Doc. E4/Urban/1999/15_EN Working Party December 1999 on Urban Statistics

Minutes

of the Working Party meeting on Urban Statistics

held in Luxembourg 9th and 10th December 1999

Participants:see the list in annex 1

1.Introduction

The chairman of the meeting, Mr Gilles Decand, welcomed the participants to this two day meeting; He explained that a new section on regional statistics was created inside his unit E4 in May 1999. This section covers not only regional accounts and regional indicators, but also urban statistics. Mr Berthold Feldmann had been appointed head of section.

The chairman emphasised that the demand for urban statistics is currently rising significantly, which is why this field is gaining importance within Eurostat. Several interesting projects had been launched concerning urban statistics, both at the Commission and at the Member State level. In order to discuss these various initiatives, the current Working Party meeting is justified. A core issue of the two day meeting would certainly be the “Urban Audit”.

The chairman explained that while the annual Working Party meeting on urban statistics used to be in spring (around April/May) each year, this was now moved to late autumn (November/December) because of the change of staff in 1999. The next meeting will thus be in November/December 2000. If need be, the SIRE database will be again on the agenda of the Working Party meeting.

The chairman presented the agenda of the Working Party meeting (see annex 2). It was approved without amendment.

2.Approval of the last minutes of 23rd, 24th April 1998

The Dutch delegate asked about the current state of the CD-ROM of SIRE, mentioned in the last minutes. The chairman explained that the contractor, the INE Portugal, had encountered technical problems. The CD-ROM will be sent to the Member States as soon as it is ready, hopefully in spring 2000.

The Dutch delegate also asked for a clarification of the terms used in the context of urban statistics. Such a clarification of terms should be provided in all languages. The chairman welcomed this suggestion. He proposed that the Member States should start in the coming months to send comments on the definitions of the most important terms. By the time of the next Working Party meeting a draft thesaurus will be presented. With these comments the minutes of April 1998 were approved.

3.The current state of the art of urban statistics

Mr Feldmann presented a summary of the current situation.

As a comment, the Italian delegate suggested that the role of regional statistical offices should be emphasised more. The chairman reminded the Working Party that Eurostat has to limit its contacts with regional statistical offices, since otherwise the communication process becomes too complex.

4.European needs for Urban Statistics

The representative of DG REGIO explained in detail the statistical needs for urban statistics of the Commission.

The French and the German delegate underlined that high costs in human resources are involved in the data collection process, so that a close dialogue would be necessary between data providers (statisticians) and data users (politicians, the Commission) in order to avoid resources being wasted. Both delegates stressed that this dialogue was not always optimal in the past.

The chairman fully supported this view. Eurostat tries to anticipate the needs of DG REGIO two years ahead via intensive communication, but sometimes failed in the past. In order to improve transparency Eurostat plans to organise a large conference in 2002 or 2003 in order to bring together the statistical system and the political users of regional statistics. This conference shall help to prepare the statistical contribution to the next structural funds round after 2005.

5.The Urban Audit

Both the representative of DG REGIO and a representative of the contractor (Ereco) presented in detail the Urban Audit pilot project.

All representatives from National Statistical Offices (NSO) judged the project as very interesting, many found it quite impressive. There was general agreement that the results of the urban audit should be published as soon as possible, so that the data could be checked thoroughly. There was also consensus that for the quality check the National Statistical Offices should be involved.

Most Member State representatives regretted in general that they were not involved in this project so far, but they would be prepared to get more involved in the future, at least as co-ordinators inside their country, much less in the data collection.

The Italian, the Dutch and the French delegates raised the question about the ownership of the Urban Audit data. For data that comes from their statistical office a fee should be paid to them. The chairman agreed that this discussion of property rights of statistics should be started. At least the NSOs should be clearly indicated as a source when data was supplied by them.

In detail the eleven NSOs that were present at the meeting expressed the following views concerning the Urban Audit:

Country / Involved so far / Prepared to get more involved in the future / Comment
DK / No / Yes / Extensive data is available
D / No / Co-ordination / Who decides the choice of cities and the variables?
E / No / Could co-ordinate
F / Yes / Yes / Comparability is essential
IRL / No / Yes to facilitate data collection
I / No / Link to census is most important; identification of urban agglomeration very difficult
NL / No / Could co-ordinate / Needs additional financial support
A / No / Co-ordination
FIN / NO / Yes / Very important topic in Finland
S / No / Co-ordination / Extensivedata available
UK / No / Focuses on NUTS level 5 data; financial funding needed

The chairman summarised the discussion as follows:

  • A thorough evaluation of the pilot project of the Urban Audit is crucial for its future. This evaluation should focus on the quality of the assembled data, the exact sources of the data and on the precise definition of the variables.
  • There is no fundamental opposition of the NSOs to the Urban Audit project. Several NSOs are prepared to help in the future with their statistical know-how, most NSOs offered to help in the co-ordination of data collection.
  • Financial support is mandatory for the future of the Urban Audit. This also applies to Eurostat itself.
  • A certain amount of data is already available in the Member States. The SIRE database with population information at the NUTS 5 level can be regarded as complementary.

6.Definition of Urban Variables

A representative of the contractor ANITE presented the current state of this project, including a draft of a Web site presentation.

The chairman characterised this study as our reference database of definitions, which should be improved continuously. He asked the Member States to send their written comments on the list of definitions to Eurostat until 28th February 2000.

The Dutch delegate criticised that the current document does not give any priorities concerning the variables and in addition often shows that the data availability concerning the geographical level is rather disappointing.

7.The Urban Statistics Database (USD)

A representative of the contractor G.I.M. presented the project.

The chairman explained that this interesting exercise makes a maximum use of existing data from SIRE (NUTS 5 level population data), the labour force survey (LFS) and the household budget survey (HBS). The evaluation of the project should check whether this information is useful to us or not.

The German delegate raised the question about the property rights of the USD data if it is published. The chairman emphasised that since the elements of the USD are public (SIRE, LFS and HBS), the results of the project are also public. It should be integrated eventually into NewCronos.

The Finish delegate expressed their wish to obtain the results of the USD.

8.Demonstration of the CIRCA Web site

Mr Maqua from Eurostat explained the main features of this new tool for disseminating documents and enabling us of electronic communication. Mr Feldmann emphasised that all documents and Powerpoint presentations of the Working Party are available in our interest group of CIRCA. He invited the participants to make intensive use of this tool.

Several delegates welcomed the creation of the CIRCA interest group of Urban Statistics.

9.The 2001 Census and Urban Statistics

The chairman explained that the next census will help to update and improve the SIRE database. Eurostat would like to know whether particular information on urban areas will be collected. He asked the Member States to answer in writing to his questions outlined in document E4/Urban/1999/9 until 28th February 2000.

10.Future Eurostat Work Program on Urban Statistics

Mr Feldmann presented the Eurostat Work Program 2000 – 2002.

The Dutch delegate expressed the view that the collection of urban statistics does not belong to the core tasks of statistical offices.

The Finish, the Portuguese and the Italian delegates emphasised that the precise definition of urban areas/cities is essential for our work.

The German delegate raised the question who chooses in future the selected cities and variables of urban statistics.

The French delegate suggested increasing the number of users of our statistics.

The chairman summarised the discussion as follows:

  • The precise definition of urban areas/cities is very important.
  • Basically the users, above all DG REGIO, decide the choice of cities and variables. The Urban Audit should be continued with the current 58 cities plus London and Paris. Beyond that the voluntary participation of cities is welcome.
  • The user needs should be clarified more.

11.Urban Statistics availability in Germany

Mr Trutzel explained the latest developments on data availability and dissemination of urban statistics in Germany.

The Dutch delegate asked about respecting confidentiality of the partly very detailed data. Me Trutzel answered that the respect of confidentiality is crucial and carefully observed.

The chairman asked about the comparability of the data between cities. Mr Trutzel answered that comparability is not assured automatically but has to be worked on. Harmonisation is, though, increasing.

12.Urban Statistics in the Netherlands

Mr Vliegen presented an interesting project of analysis of urban agglomerations using small area information.

13.Urban Statistics in Scandinavian Countries

Ms Manninen highlighted the very advanced data collection of the four Northern European countries (Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland).

The Swedish delegate asked about the comparability of the data. Ms Manninen answered that there is a very close co-operation with the National Statistical Offices who assure comparability.

14.The identification of urban areas in France

Mr Choffel explained the sophisticated French approach of identifying urban areas with the aid of census population data.

15.Miscellaneous

The chairman informed the Working Party that NUTS 99 was recently published by Eurostat. This new version of NUTS incorporates all recent changes since 1995 in Germany, Ireland, Finland, Sweden and the United Kingdom.

This version of NUTS will be valid for the coming years. Eurostat will collect all changes for some years and produce a new version of NUTS when it is appropriate.

The next Working Party on Urban Statistics will be in November or December 2000.

1

Working Party December 1999 on Urban Statistics

ANNEX 1: LIST OF PARTICIPANTS

EU Countries

DenmarkLars PEDERSENDanmarks Statistik
Koebenhavn

GermanySabine KÖHLERStat.Bundesamt,Wiesbaden
Ernst-Otto WALTER Stat.Landesamt Bayern
Klaus TRUTZELStadt Nürnberg

SpainFernando CARRASCO CANALSINE - Madrid

FinlandNiemi ErkkiStat. Finland, Helsinki
Marja Tammilehto-LuodeStat. Finland, Helsinki
Asta MANNINENCity of Helsingi Urban Facts
Tarja PYöriäMinistry of the Interior

FrancePhilippe CHOFFELINSEE – Paris

IrelandDamian MALONECSO, Dublin

ItalyGiovanni BARBIERIISTAT-CRT, Roma
Fabio CRESCENZI

NetherlandsMathieu VLIEGENStat.Netherlands, Voorburg

AustriaMartin WEBERÖSTAT, Wien

PortugalHenrique ALBERGARIAINE

SwedenMarianne ErikssonStat. Sweden, Stockholm
Agneta THERMAENIUS

United KingdomDev VIRDEEONS - London

EFTA

NorwayErik ENGELIENStatistics Norway
Kongsvinger

CEEC

BulgariaSerguey TSVETARSKINational Statistical Institute,
Sofia

Czech RepublicMiloslav CHLADCzech Statistical Office Plzen

HungaryAlbert FLANUVEGIHungarian Central Statistical
Office, Budapest

LatviaJolanta SUPECentral Statistical Bureau, Riga

LithuaniaDaiva JURELEVICIENEDepartment of Statistics, Vilnius

PolandAlicija PAWLOWSKA-PALCentral Statistical Office

RomaniaMaria RADULESCUNational Commission for Crina TURTOI Statistics, Bucharest

Slovak RepublicAgnesa KRALIKOVASlovak Statistical Office Bratislava

SloveniaBranko PAVLINStatistical Office, Ljubljana

Bosna I HerzegovnaŠevala KORAJČVIĆFederl Institute of Statistics

Commission

EurostatGilles DECAND(chairman)
Berthold FELDMANN(secretary)
Daniel RASE
Kjartan BJÖRNSSON

DG REGIO / A-1Mireille GRUBERT

Contractors

AniteOlivier Bouillé

CESD-CommunautaireWillibald CROI

G. I. MMargaret HALL

ERECONick BOZEAT

ANNEX 2: Agenda of the Working Party

Topic / No / Author
1. Introduction
a) Adoption of the agenda / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/1
b) Adoption of the minutes of 23rd, 24th April 1998 / Doc. E/LOC/79
c) Current situation of European urban statistics / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/2 / Feldmann
2. European needs for urban statistics / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/3 / Grubert
3. The "Urban Audit"
a) Objective and scope (history) / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/4 / Grubert
b) Description of the first urban audit / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/5 / Bozeat
b) The follow-up / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/6 / Grubert
4. Definitions of urban variables / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/7 / Bouillé
5. Database of urban statistics / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/8 / Hall
6. The 2001 Census and urban statistics / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/9 / Decand
7. Eurostat work program 2000-2002 / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/10 / Feldmann
8. National projects
a) Germany / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/11 / Trutzel
b) Netherlands / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/12 / Vliegen
c) Finland / Doc. E4/Urban/1999/13 / Manninen
d) France / Room document / Choffel
9. CIRCA presentation
10. Any other business

page 1