VRSExtendedEmploymentRule RevisionAdvisoryCommittee

Session Notes for February 24, 2015

ConvenedbyMinnesotaDEEDVocationalRehabilitationServices

MeetingDetails

Date:Tuesday,February24,2015

Time:10:00am–3:00pm

Location:ProAct,Eagan,MN55121

Chair:JohnSherman,VRSExtendedEmploymentProgramDirector

Facilitator:HollyJohnson,LanternaConsulting,Inc.contractedthroughManagementAnalysisDevelopment,MinnesotaManagementandBudget

Advisorymembers(oralternates) inattendance: JeffBangsberg,LauraBealey,TimDickie,SteveDitschler,TimHammond,AnitaKavitz,JeremyGurney,NancyHuizenga,HollyJohnson,KarenJohnston,ClaytonLiend,RodPederson,DeanRitzman,JohnShermanandJohnSherwood-Gabrielson(joinedat1:15pm)

Guests:LeannKleaverandDanMills,VRSCounselors

KeyPerspectivesforEERuleRevisionWork

Throughouttheprocess,advisorymembersareasked tokeepasystemwideviewfortheEERuleRevisiontopicdiscussions.The fivekeyperspectivesaresummarizedas:

  1. AdvocacyOrganizations
  2. PublicPartners
  • Locallevel-counties,municipalities, etc.e.g.RamseyCounty
  • Statelevel- agencies,etc.e.g.Departmentof HumanServices(DHS),Minnesota OlmsteadPlan
  • Federal level
  1. ExtendedEmployment(EE)Providers
  2. EEWorkers
  • Currently working
  • Eligiblebut notcurrentlyworking
  1. VRS-EERule'Owner'andAccountableAgency
  • VRS EE team:John Sherman,Anita Kavitz andWendyKeller
  • OtherDEEDandVRSstaff

WelcomeandOpeningRemarks

Themeetingwascalledto order.ThefacilitatorHollyJohnsonprovided abriefoverviewofthemeetingobjectives andagenda.JohnShermanintroducedguestobserversVRSCounselorsLeann KleaverandDanMills.

AdvisorySessionObjectives:

1.Workingsessionfocusedon developmentofanewEEprogram fundingmodel.

2.GatherkeystakeholderperspectivesandinputtoassistMinnesotaDEEDVocationalRehabilitationServicesintheEERuleRevisionprocess.

3.ContinuedexplorationanddiscussionrelatedtoADA,OlmsteadandtheWorkforceInnovationand OpportunityAct(WIOA)andtheircombinedimplicationsforMinnesota'sExtendedEmploymentRulerevision.

TheadvisorywasremindedtoreviewthedraftJanuary27,2015sessionnotesandaskedtoprovideanyeditsby February27,2015afterwhichtimethenoteswouldbefinalized.

Follow-upandUpdatessincetheJanuary2015Meeting

TheU.S.DepartmentsofLabor andEducationareworkingtodevelop asetofregulationsforimplementationofWIOAundertheaggressivetimelineset forthinthelegislation.Draftregulationswereoriginallyforecastfor endofJanuary2015 howeverareviseddraftreleasedatehasnowbeenforecastforMarch21.

JohnShermanalsoprovideda briefupdateontheEE legislativeprogressandtheGovernor'sbudget.TosupporttheadministrativehearingandtechnicalprocessesrelatedtotheEERule Revision,Johnhasreceivedapprovalforan additional staff.

Asof8:20amthismorning,draftbill SF1533language wasreleasedfromtheGovernor'sofficeand isnowavailable tothepublic.JeffBangsbergrequestedtohavethedraftbillsenttothe advisoryto share with othersandJohn agreed.Thedraftwasdeveloped andinformedbytheEEAdvisory conversationssinceDecember2014.ThedraftincludeslanguagethatopenstheEEprogramprocesstoincludelargemedicalinstitutionalprovidersaswellasintroducesdefinitionalupdatesasamendedfromWIOAsuch asinformedchoiceandintegratedsettings.UponreleasefromtheGovernor'soffice,Johnwasallowed toprovidea copytoMOHR'slobbyistShepHarrisandMOHRmembersKarenJohnston andSteve Ditschler.Karen JohnstonprovidedabriefupdateontheMOHRinput activitiesover thepastfewdaysleadingto hertestimonyduringintheSenateJobspolicycommittee.

Johndistributedabrief summaryofthedraftlanguagemodificationsdevelopedwithMOHRandamendedtothedraftbilllanguagefor 'Article4ExtendedEmploymentProgramChanges'.Theadvisoryreviewedthedraftlanguageandaskedquestionsforunderstandingandclarification.

Nextstepsinthelegislativeprocessinclude:

  1. thedraftlanguage isintroduced to membersofthelegislatureto seekabillco-author andseekahearing.
  2. thehearingprovidesanopportunityforinterestedpartiestotestifyregardingthebill.OnceVRSEE learns thatthebillisupforhearing,wewillnotify theadvisorycommittee.
  3. thecommitteeprocessforpolicyalone,isconductedintheSenateandtheprocessforpolicy, includingafiscal note,areconductedintheHouse.Note: atthispointthe bill does nothave 'fiscal note'.
  4. oncethebillpassesthroughappropriatedcommittees,then thelanguagewilllikelybe addedto largerbillsineachbody.
  5. ifpassedoffthefloor,then thebillgoestoconferencecommitteewheresometimesthepolicybillsare runseparately.
  6. ifthebillis votedintostatestatutesometimebeforeMaythentherulewritingprocessisanticipatedtoflowmuchsmoother.

Karen Johnston inquiredabouttheeffective dateifthebillbecomesstatute. Johnagreedthat itisanimportantquestionandrespondedwith thefollowing: if thestatutedoesnotinvolveafiscalnotethenitwouldlikelybecomeeffectiveJuly2015however ifthestatute impactspolicyandfiscalthen it wouldlikelybeeffective August 2015.

Statutetakesprecedenceoverrule.He saidthattheeffectivedatehasnotbeendevelopedandthatitmightmakesensetoconsidertheprogrambenefitsforstatuteandrulegoingintoeffect togetherpossiblytargetingJuly2016tominimize potentialEEprogramservicedisconnectsanddisruptions.NancyHuizengaraisedatimingissueforlanguageas it relatestoAllinaandimplementation implications.Johnagreedtolookintotheissue.

Advisorycommentondraftbilllanguage: We seeanissuebetweentwofederalpoliciesbeingatcrosspurposesattheintersectionofdraftstatuteofintegratedsetting(<=50%)withthefederalAbilityOne contractrequirementsofthepercentageofdisabledpersonsintheprogram(=>75%).The issuesincludetheintegrationcomponentaswellastheratespaidforwork.

Advisorycommentondraftbilllanguage: It appearsthat"whathappenstocommunityemployment"isthepolicyquestion.Oneofourquestionsis wheredoesthe systemprovideforsupport tothosewiththemost challenged skillsets?Tim Hammondnotedthat anyfundingmodelshould movetoward reducedservicesovertimeformanyoftheprogramparticipantsandthatthosemoniesshouldthenbemadeavailabletoothersforservices.Johnstatedthat DEEDand providersalikedonotalwaysknowwhereprogramparticipantsgowithservices andacrossotherprograms/fundingsources.

AsJohnwrappeduptheupdatesportionofthemeeting,Karen JohnstonthankedhimandVRSforthewaytheyhaveprovidedtransparencyandopportunitiesfor inputintotheEE Rule revisionprocessbyconveninganEE RulemakingAdvisoryCommittee.ShenotedthatMOHRiscomposedofalargenumberof organizations(100+)who provideawidearrayofservices eachofwhomhavetheir ownperspectivesandconstituents.ShenotedthatClaytonLiendhasbeen diligent insendingoutinformationontheadvisory'sdiscussiontoMOHR.Heandthe otherMOHRrepresentativesonthecommitteearealsodoingtheir besttoassist othermembersin gainingabetterunderstandingoftheissuesandworkofthisgroupandprovidingopportunitiestoaskquestionsandweigh in.

BuildingaNewFundingModelfortheExtendedEmploymentProgram

Followingthereviewofthe draft statutelanguage,Johnopenedtheworkingsessionfocusedon building anewfundingmodelfortheEE Program.Hedistributedcopies ofhis'RedesignoftheEEFundingSystem2/24/2015'presentationmaterials.

HebeganwithabriefreviewoftheEEfundingguidelinespreviouslydevelopedanddiscussedbytheadvisorycommitteeassummarized:

  • Maintainapredictableperformance-basedfundingsystem,including:
  • Reimbursehoursofworkperformedbypersonsserved
  • Differentialreimbursementratesbasedon averagehourlywageofpersonsserved
  • Competitiveemploymentisfirstpriorityforfunding
  • Cappingnon-competitiveemploymentwillnotdisplacecurrentpersonsserved
  • Downsizingofnon-competitiveemploymentmodelswillbescheduledandpredictable,andwilldemonstratemeasuredchangeoverareasonabletimeperiod
  • Possibleconsiderationforimpactofinflationonreimbursementrates
  • Incentiveswillbeconsideredtofacilitate/rewardconversion

Johnalsoreviewedthe advisorycommittee'sconsensuskeypointsdevelopedandendorsedattheJanuary27,2015meeting as it relatestoanewEEfundingmodel:

  • IncrementaleliminationofCenterBasedEmployment(CBE)withinfiveyears;
  • IncludebothCenter BasedEmployment(CBE)andCommunityEmployment(CE)inthenon-competitivefund,withdifferentratesandtwotimelines;
  • Sunsettingoneofthefunds -centerbased;
  • Cappingnon-competitiveemployment;
  • AftercenterbasedisreducedandultimatelyeliminatedfromtheEEprogram,theresourcesmovetootherservices;
  • Bettertrackingsystemwillbevitaltothenewmodel
  • Theimplicationsofthespecialwagecertificate willimpacttimingforCommunityEmployment(CE)basedonwhathappenswiththe subminimumwageunderWIOAregulationsyettobereleased.

Johnthenprovided an introductiontoadraftfunding modelwithanumber of variablesdevelopedfordiscussionpurposesonlyusing2014 ratesasthe basis.Themodelvariationsincluded assumptionsusinga)currentrates,b)ratesusingSupportedEmploymentasapercentofhourlywages(40%),c)ratesusing50%ofhourlywage(wouldrequire fiscalnote togetenough resourcestofundthemodel),and d)rates using45%ofhourlywage totrytoaddress thefundinglevelissue in (c).

Theafternoon sessionwasfocusedonthetopicof overproductiontopicwhichbeganwiththefollowingOverproductionKeyPoints:

  • LimitedtoSupportedEmployment
  • Couldberetroactive;i.e.fundedfromunderproduction,likewageincentive
  • Couldadjust startingpointforthenext year
  • Couldbetargetedtoregionortargetpopulations

Johnaskedtheadvisoryfortheirthoughtsonhowtoencouragenewpopulationsandnewgeographicareas into thesystem. Henotedthatthedollarscouldbetargetedtosupportexistingservices.Oneofthebig open questionstherulerevisionmust isaddressishowtodistributethe overproduction.Johnsaidanargumentforoverproductionisthatitmightbeusedto incentivizeorganizationswhocurrentlyprovideforSupportedEmploymenttoincreasecapacitytoserve.

JeremyGurneyaskedaboutthepossibilitiesofprioritizingthe use ofmoniestofirstsupportSupportedEmployment(SE)andfundSEoverproduction.Anymoniesleftthengoestoanon-competitive 'pot of monies'tobedistributedto other services.John saidthatsuchanapproachwouldposetimingissuesbecause of whenwe would knowwhat'savailabletobedistributedtononcompetitive. HestatedthattheprimarypurposeofEE istofundSupported Employmentand anythingleft overcan beredistributed.TheMinnesota OlmsteadPlan isexpectedtoincreasethedemandforSupportedEmployment.TimDickie noted thatOlmsteadisalsoaboutmoving peoplefromnoncompetitivetocompetitivesothe system shouldhelpincentivizethatmovement-justpayingformoreSupportedEmployment overproductiondoesnotnecessarilyaccomplishthat.Johnaskedtheadvisoryaboutusingoverproductionasamechanismtosupportthemovement.SteveDitschlerremindedtheadvisorythat wedon'treallyknowtheactuallevelofoverproductionoccurringinthesystembecausemanyorganizations arenotreportingit oncetheyhaveuseduptheirfunding.

RodPedersonaskedifthere are moniestoallownewpeopleintothesystem?SteveDitschleraskedaboutusingmoniesfor fundingtransitionyouth rather thanoverproductiongiventheincreasedemphasisontransitionyouthwithinWIOAandotherpolicies.Thecommittee discussedthepotentialbenefitsofreducingfundingovertimeandseeinghowchange unfoldstomonitorforunintendednegativeconsequences.Rodalsoexpressed concernsabouttherelative impactweighttometrovs.greaterMinnesotaaswellastheskill levelsofthepopulationsbeing served. Johnsaidonepossibilitycouldbeforthe ruletoincludesomeprovisionsfor fundingoverproductiontargetedforspecificdisabilitygroupsand/orgeographicregions.

TimHammond saidthatoverproductionwilloccur atanunpredictablelevelhoweverthatdoesnotimpacttherateswewillpayinthesystem. AnitaKavitzremindedtheadvisorytothinkaboutoverproduction intermsoftwophases:a)Overproductionforthecurrentsystem we'reinandduringatransitionperiodandb)onanongoingbasisoncethetransitionperiodiscomplete.Do wemakeanyaccommodationsforthosedoingoverproductionknowingthatthemaximum wecouldeverfundisbasedontheunderproduction?Whichhighlightsthefactthatcurrentlyeverythingistiedtounderproduction.John addedthatthereareCRPconcernsthatweareproducingunreimbursed servicesforexisting consumersand thatwedonothaveanymonieslefttobringnewpeople into receiveservicesthroughtheEEprograme.g.transitionyouthchallenges.John stressedthefactthat ifwe're alreadylimitedandthereare nomoniesforreimbursement,thenwecannotbringanynewpeopleintothesystem.Asanexample, John notedthatlastyearthere wasasubstantialamountofdollarsfromunderproductionandthatthedollarswillberedistributedtoproviders withoverproduction.There isa timelagthatimpactsourservicesanditbolstersan argumentforamoreeffectivedistributionmechanism.Currently,theprimaryincentiveforproviderstoreportoverproductionhoursisthattheprovidermayearnmorewageincentivedollars.

KarenJohnstonaskedwhatifwetookunderproductionfromCenterBasedEmploymentandCommunityEmployment andautomaticallyputitintoSupportedEmploymentsincethelongterm goalistofundSupportedEmployment?It wouldhelptocontinuetoshrinkthepot withouttakingawayfromcurrentconsumersserved.JohnandRodnotedthat itsoundedlike amoreequitableapproachthansome. Tim Hammondsaidhethought suchanapproachwould be supported byJudge Frank. JeffBangsbersnotedit wouldbackupthetalkwith incentives.Anitacounteredthatthisstrategyaloneissimilarto whatwe'vebeendoingalready andthatitprobably would notbe sufficientbyitselftoaffectthe levelofchangedirectedbytheDepartmentofJustice and theOlmstead Decision.

Karenasked about combiningsuch astrategywiththecapping.Johnnotedthatthereisachallenge in balancinghelpwithoverproductionforexistingproviderswithensuringfundsforopportunitiesfor newprovidersandtoaddressunmetneedstoexpandtheoverallsystemcapacity.Both setsofinterestsarevalid.

SteveDitschleraskedifwewouldbebetterservedbygoingtothelegislaturefornewmoniesforunmetneeds.John saidthat inhismanyyearsof experiencewiththelegislature, it hasbeenveryseldomthatoutsidegroupshavegonefornewmonies.Inaddition,VRShas notbeenabletoaskforfunds andhistoricallythedepartmenthasbeenlimitedintheirabilitytorequestprogramincreaseswithintheagencyandGovernor'sbudgets.MostrequestsfromMACRO(nowMOHR)wereforrateincreases.Realistically,fundingnewtargetedpopulationshasnotbeensomethingeitherinternalorexternalforceshaveachievedmuchsuccess.Theyhasseensomesuccessforafewnewpopulations inspecializedareassuchasIPS.Andnowthere is anotherpushtodomoreforDeaf andHardof Hearingbutneitherofthese effortsareattachedtotheExtendedEmploymentprogram.

JeffBangsbergaskedif unmetneeds can bemetbycurrentproviders.John said yeshowever eventhosehaveunevenresults.Anitaasked theadvisoryfortheirideasonhowtohelpmakedollarsavailablefor newservicesand new areas.TheDepartmentofJusticehasbeen clearinitsexpectationthatpeople shouldnot betrackedintononcompetitiveemploymentfortherestoftheirlives.

LauraBealeysharedthattheirCRPisfocusedoncreatingaclearerexpectationwithemployersaroundindividualshired inthecommunityemploymentprogram.MRCIisaskingemployersupfront toconsiderhiringan individualincommunityemploymentafter90days.Laurasaidthatanumber ofemployersare receptivetothisapproach.Shenotedotherhiringbarriersforemployeesthattendtoextendcommunityemployment:someemployersarehiringnomorethan99people sotheydon'thitthe100employeelevelrequirementforhealthinsurance.She said that CommunityEmployment canbeeffectiveasajobtryoutandthatemployerstrusttheCRP asaresource.Ithasbeenastrategythataddressesthe"stayon acrewforever"issue andithelpswiththetransitionprocessanddirection.

TheadvisorycommitteecontinuestohavesignificantconcernsaboutindividualswiththemostsignificantdisabilitieswhomaynothavethenecessaryskillstoaccomplishthetasksneededtoachievetheSupportedEmployment levelofservices.Thereisapotential dangerinlosingthe'middlesteps'ofCommunityEmploymentthatshouldbeconsidered inthe rule writingprocess.There isalsovalueinearninggoodwages withinaCommunityEmploymentservice thatshouldbeconsideredasagoodoutcome.Weneedfundingtosupportthoseservices.

TimHammondchallenged thecommitteetoconsiderthatifindividualshaveneverbeen'outinthe community',thentheywouldnotnecessarilychoosetomoveortryintegratedandcommunityemploymentwithoutmoreintentionalexperiencesandencouragement.TimnotedthatwhiletherepresentativeCRPsonthecommitteehavebeenworkinghardtoassist individualswith finding competitiveemployment inthe mostintegratedsettings,notalltheprovidershavebeenproactivein encouragingindividuals inthespirit oftrueinformed choice.

JeffBangsbergagreed sharingthathisparentsweretoldhe"wouldnevergetoutofanursinghome".Jeffexpressedhisbeliefthatwe allhavegoodintentionsandthat whatweare discussingisabouthoware wegoingtodo the best wecaninthebest interestsofthoseweserve.Jeffsaidweneedto givepeople theopportunitytoexperiencedifferentenvironmentsandgivethememploymentopportunities inthecommunitywheneverwecan.Johnsaid thatweneedto continueto learnmoreabout thefactorskeepingpeopleinlesscompetitiveenvironments.

SteveDitschlernotedthatthetransitiontomoreintegratedsettingswillbehelpedbytheyoungerdemographics.Individualscomingintotheprogramfromtransitionyouthwillnotevenbeexposedto'shelteredworkshops'andmanyindividualscurrentlyinCenterBased Employmentarenaturallyagingout ofthesystem.Advisorymembersnotedthatmostyoungerparentshavehighexpectationsfortheirchildren'sparticipationinemploymentandcommunityexperiences.

RecapofAdvisoryCommitteeConsensusandKeyPoints

TheadvisorycommitteereinforcedtheimportanceofcommunicatingwithEEprogramparticipantsandstakeholdersthatthecommitteeisstronglyin favorof changestonon-competitiveemploymentservicesoccurringoveraperiodoftimeratherthanabruptly.Clearly,therevisedrulemustmeetthe requirementsofOlmsteadandWIOA.Theyarelawandnot optional.Thehopeofthe advisorycommittee isthattheserequirementswillbeeffectivelymetwhileprovidingsufficientsupporttotransitionimpactedprogramparticipantsandEEproviderstomoreSupportedEmploymentservicesovertime.

Oneideageneratedbytheadvisorycommitteeforadditionalconsideration:

  • TheSupportedEmployment poolofdollarswouldbepermanentlyincreasedbytheunderperformance inbothCenterBasedEmploymentandCommunityEmployment.AndthosedollarsmovedarepermanentlyallocatedtoSupportedEmploymentratherthanrevertbackin subsequentfundingyears.Thisideaalignswiththeprogram's purposeofbuildingSupportedEmployment.An openquestionremainsonredistribution.Wemayor maynot eliminatetheRFPasanoptionforredistribution.Itmayusedforrates.Wemaykeepinplacethevoluntaryoptiontomovethedollarsfromnoncompetitivetocompetitiveemploymentservices.

Theadvisoryaskedaboutcontinuingdiscussion at thenextmeetingregardingoptionstoratchetdowntherateaswemovethroughthetransitionperiodtogiveproviderstimetoadjust.StartingatthecurrentrateandthendecreasingtherateovertimetoacceleratethemovementtowardsSupportiveEmploymentwhileretainingCommunityEmploymentaspartoftheinformedchoicerange ofserviceswithintheEE Program.

Lookingtowardsthenextadvisoryworkingsession inMarch,Johnforecastmorediscussiononthe communityemployment topicandpotentialtimetables(proposedfor7years).The advisoryexpressedcontinuedsupportfora modelthatreducesfundingtocenterbased overfiveyears tozeroandcontinuestoincludeCommunityEmploymentwithinanoncompetitivefundfortheEEProgram.Johnaskedtheadvisorytoreviewthelegislativeissuesanddraft language. Othertopicsfordiscussion include:increasingtherateforSupportedEmployment,discussiononkeepingoverproductionasanoptionwithinthe systemandhowtodealwithitinthecontextofre-establishingbases andhandlingunearneddollarseachyear.

WrapUp

In conclusion,Johnthankedthe advisorycommitteefortheirwork.Heand Anitawillmoveforwardwiththeinputsprovidedtofurther developdraftmodelsforthenextmeetingscheduledforMarch17th.

NextSteps:

  1. Johnwillsend an electroniccopyofthedraft statutelanguage tothe advisorycommittee.
  2. Theadvisoryagreedtocontinueproactivesharing andcascadingoftheworkoftheVRSEERuleRevisionAdvisoryCommitteewithotherEEsystemmembersnotablythemembershipof MinnesotaOrganizationforHabilitationandRehabilitation(MOHR)for thebenefit of inputandsupportfortherevision.
  3. Thenextadvisorycommitteemeetingswillbeasfollows:
  4. Tuesday,March17th,10:00amto3:00pm
  5. Tuesday,April21st,10:30amto3:00pm
  6. HostedatProact,3195NeilArmstrongBlvd,Eagan, MN55121.
  7. PreviewforMarch17,2015WorkingSession:
  8. ThenextcommitteemeetingisanticipatedtodelveintopotentialratesandcappingforCommunityEmploymentaspartofanewEE programfundingmodel.
  9. ThecommitteewillalsotalkfurtheraboutpotentialincentivestoassistinthetransitionandtransformationoftheprograminalignmentwithOlmstead,Minnesota'sEmploymentFirstPolicyandthenewWorkforceInnovationandOpportunityAct(WIOA).

MeetingAdjourned

Themeetingwasadjournedat 3:00pm.

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