ChandlerGilbertCommunity College Interviewee: Ramirez
Recorded Statement
1
ChandlerGilbertCommunity College Interviewee: Ramirez
Q = José Ramirez
A = Emiquio Ramirez Vera
B = Kim Chuppa-Cornell
1
ChandlerGilbertCommunity College Interviewee: Ramirez
1
ChandlerGilbertCommunity College Interviewee: Ramirez
TRANSLATION/TRANSCRIPTION OF A SPANISH AUDIO
B:So go ahead and talk into the microphone and make sure we...
Q:Okay.
B:Can hear you both.
Q:Speak into the microphone to see if we can hear you. Just tell me your, is it, how close do you want it?
B:It it...
A:(Inaudible).
B:Has pretty good range so...
Q:(Inaudible).
B:You don’t need to be too close.
Q:She says that you you do not have to be so close.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:That is fine like that.
A:Okay yes.
Q:That is fine. Get comfortable.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:Um tell us your your name quickly?
A:Uh Mi- uh Emiquio(sp?) Ramirez Vera that is it.
B:That’s good and if you don’t mind just telling us the date...
Q:Okay.
B:Before we get started?
Q:In Span- in English?
B:Oh anything it could all be in Spanish...
Q:Uh-huh.
B:‘Cause she’ll she’ll translate and transcribe so uh-huh.
Q:Okay so today’s the 27th, right?
B:Uh-huh.
Q:27th.
B:Yes.
Q:Okay.
B:Uh-huh.
Q:Today’s date is March 27 of 1910(sic). We are interviewing Emiquio Ramirez Vera. Um we are going to start. What is your name?
A:Emiquio Ramirez Vera.
Q:When were you born?
A:August 5, 1931.
Q:And where were you born?
A:In Chilacauapan(sp?), state of Oaxaca, Mexico.
Q:And where did you grow up?
A:In Patlanalan(sp?) uh uh Oaxaca, Mexico.
Q:And what year were you involved with the Bracero Program?
A:In 1951.
Q:In March? March 3rd...
A:March 3rd of 1951.
Q:How old were you when you participated or or were you married or single or did you have children?
A:I was 20 years old. I was single.
B:Uh-huh.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:How did you find out about the program?
A:By uh people from the government from the state for they were the ones that that were in charge of those lists.
Q:Why did you decide to come over?
A:It was to better the economic situation.
Q:What type of work were you doing during this time in other words before coming over before coming coming here to the United States?
A:Uh I was planting corn, beans, uh some vegetable plants or vegetables.
Q:Vegetables.
A:Uh-huh.
B:Uh-huh.
Q:And and did you have cattle you did not have cattle?
A:No.
Q:No.
A:No.
Q:Only plants...
A:Only plants.
Q:(Inaudible) plants okay and did your whole family dedicate their time to growing plants or all of the did all of the people of the town do the same thing?
A:Yes that was what we did.
Q:You you cultivated...
A:You cultivated in that area.
Q:Patlanalan was a town that was more agricultural?
A:Uh yes well agriculture and cattle.
Q:Oh okay very good and you just lived in Patlanalan before coming to the United States or did you go to live some someplace else and then you came to the United States?
A:Uh I just lived there. I had to go to a centralized center for Braceros that is named Irapuato Guanajuato.
Q:Okay so then from Patlanalan you went to Irapuato Guanajuato...
A:Guanajuato.
Q:For a while and how long were you there?
A:It was quick because I did not take very much time it was quick. Uh I contracted myself in the Bracero Program to come to work.
Q:Uh-huh what do you remember doing to prepare yourself to come to the United States?
A:Saving a little bit of money to provide for expenses.
Q:To get to to Guanajuato.
A:To get to yes uh-huh.
Q:And from Guanajuato did you have to pay to get into the United States?
A:No because the person that did the contracting the United States government covered the expenses.
Q:The expenses?
A:Uh-huh.
Q:So then you only had expenses to to Guanajuato.
A:Yes when when I arrived.
Q:When you arrived at Guanajuato?
A:At Guanajuato.
Q:And when you arrived at Guanajuato did you already have a place to stay for a while before coming to the United States?
A:Uh uh no those were the expenses that one had that...
Q:That you had...
A:Were personal because once you were contracted it was all it was different.
Q:Different.
A:I mean they quickly sent us to to the center for for contracting.
Q:And um what what means of transportation did you use from Guanajuato to United States how did you how did you go in an airplane uh uh...
A:The...
Q:A truck?
A:The first time I came it was uh I was transported by train from the city of Guanajuato to Mexicali, Baja CaliforniaMexico.
Q:To Mexico by train?
A:Uh-huh by train.
Q:Okay and were there a lot of people from the Bras- Bracero Program with you...
A:Yes because...
Q:On the train?
A:The train was big and there were a lot of uh contracted people from different states of the MexicanRepublic.
Q:So when you got to Mexicali how long did you stay there before crossing into the United States?
A:The same uh in the same day we crossed the border.
Q:The border.
A:And after we crossed the border there was a truck there that was taking us to the contracting center in El Centro, California.
Q:El Centro, California?
A:Uh-huh.
B:Uh was he alone or did brothers come did friends come?
Q:Uh-huh um did you come alone um this time or did you have brothers with you um cousins...
B:Friends?
Q:Friends?
A:Uh I came with several family members.
B:Uh-huh.
Q:Oh really? How how many were there?
B:Yes.
A:Uh we were like seven seven...
B:Oh uh-huh uh-huh.
A:People.
Q:Seven people?
A:Yes.
Q:From from the same town?
A:From the same town.
B:Oh okay okay.
Q:From the town.
A:Yes my mother’s brothers and cousins.
Q:And cousins.
B:Uh-huh uh-huh uh-huh.
A:Cousins also uh-huh.
Q:Oh that is nice.
B:Okay.
Q:And were you all the same age?
A:No.
Q:No.
A:No.
Q:Were you...
A:I was I was the youngest.
Q:You were...
A:Yes.
Q:The youngest...
A:Yes.
Q:Of the group?
A:Of the group.
B:Oh.
Q:Okay.
A:Yes of of the seven of us.
Q:Of the seven of you?
A:Yes.
Q:Of the seven you were...
A:Of the seven yes.
Q:You were...
A:I was the youngest.
Q:The youngest of the...
A:Yes.
Q:Of the seven?
A:Uh-huh.
Q:And how old was the oldest person?
A:Uh he was like 40 years old.
Q:40 years old?
A:Yes my mother’s brother.
Q:Brother.
A:Yes and another one was like 38 years old.
Q:38.
A:Also my mother’s brother.
B:Oh.
A:Yes...
Q:Your mother’s brothers.
A:Yes.
Q:Okay.
A:And some other cousins more or less of the same age.
Q:Of the same age?
A:Yes.
Q:Oh really okay okay uh and and what were your expectations?
A:Well come to learn and to work to make money.
Q:Yes.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:And did you also come with the desire of maybe learning English?
A:Well the desire to learn English was very little because where we were, we were all Mexican.
Q:Mexican?
A:Uh-huh.
Q:Yes okay...
B:(Inaudible).
Q:Yes okay okay so then your desire was just to or or your expectations were to just come to work, complete your time, and to go back to Mexico to your town?
A:Yes that is that is right.
Q:With no interest in staying in the United States?
A:Well no...
Q:No.
A:Because there was always the interest to return...
Q:Return.
A:To the the family you know?
Q:With the family...
A:Uh-huh with my parents.
Q:And and also the ones that were with you they also wanted to just come to work and return...
A:Yes.
Q:And not stay?
A:No not stay.
Q:No not stay?
A:Not to stay. I...
Q:And and no one had the desire to return later on?
A:Yes yes because we completed the contract and we would leave and then later if you wanted to come back again well then you could...
Q:You could?
A:You could come back uh-huh.
Q:Okay what did when you came over what did you bring with you and why?
A:Well what I brought with me was my birth certificate, a military card, and the to continue uh forward in the program.
Q:Uh-huh no did you bring a lot of clothing uh a small amount of...
A:Yes yes...
Q:Clothing?
A:A small amount?
Q:How many changes?
A:Like three or four.
Q:Three or four changes?
A:Three uh-huh.
Q:And how many pairs of shoes did you bring?
A:Of that only one.
Q:One pair of shoes?
B:(Inaudible).
A:Yes.
Q:One pair of shoes? Okay...
A:Yes.
Q:And how much money did you have with you?
A:Well you always had enough to you never knew what could happen.
Q:Yes but...
A:Uh-huh.
Q:Like how much in that time how much did you have? Did you have like...
A:Well...
Q:50 pesos 100 pesos?
A:Well like 50 pesos.
Q:50 pesos?
A:Yes because everything was much cheaper.
Q:Much cheaper?
A:Yes.
Q:And do you remember how many pesos um purchased a dollar at that time?
A:Uh 480 that was what...
Q:4 pesos...
A:4 pesos 80 cents...
Q:80...
A:Was what a dollar cost.
Q:A dollar...
A:Yes.
Q:A dollar uh-huh uh-huh that is good.
A:Then it went up to 8 and 8 dolla- 8 pesos and 80 cents I think also.
Q:Yes and did you bring anything with you that reminded you of your mother?
A:Well I was a little bit uh happy to go because I I was going to go to cro- uh enter into the United States but there was also the the nostalgia of leaving your family.
Q:Family.
A:Your parents.
Q:Your parents.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:And and were your parents in agreement with you coming to to the United States?
A:Uh well yes yes they were in agreement and and like I said they also thought they were afraid that something that something would happen to me because I was well I did not have a lot of experience.
Q:Yes.
B:Was he the oldest in his family?
Q:The youngest.
B:Oh he’s the youngest in his family?
Q:Yeah (inaudible).
B:(Inaudible).
Q:Um at that time you were the youngest um there were you had a brother and a and a sister?
A:Y-...
Q:Yes?
A:Yes.
Q:Yes.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:And what was your brother’s name?
A:Vicente Martinez(sp?) Vera.
Q:And did he did he come with you at that time?
A:No.
Q:He he stayed?
A:No he was already he was already working here.
Q:Oh he was already here?
A:Yes in in...
Q:Here in...
A:Phoenix.
Q:In Phoenix. Was he already in the Bracero Program...
A:Bracero.
Q:Also?
A:Uh-huh.
B:Oh.
Q:And your sister what is her name?
A:Laura(sp?) Vera.
Q:Laura Vera.
A:Yes.
Q:But she was not here, correct?
A:No.
Q:She she stayed there.
A:She stayed over there.
Q:She stayed.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:Okay and how old were you when your brother came?
B:Uh-huh.
Q:How old were you when your brother came over?
A:Uh like 17 16 17 years old.
Q:When when your brother came over?
A:Yes uh-huh.
Q:And how old was your brother when he came?
A:Uh well I think that he was like 21 years old...
Q:21.
A:22 like that.
Q:Oh really?
A:Yes.
Q:When he came.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:So then he was already here because uh for several years?
A:Yes.
Q:He was already...
A:Yes he had been here for several years already.
Q:Uh-huh and and was your goal also to come and look for your brother?
A:Yes yes because I arrived in King City, California but my goal was to look for him because for like three or four years we did not hear...
Q:From your brother.
A:From him.
Q:Uh-huh.
A:Uh-huh so then that was what brought me...
Q:Also.
A:From there also.
Q:In other words make money and look for your brother?
A:Yes uh yes and that.
Q:Uh-huh.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:That is good and your brother never called or he never communicated with you?
A:Uh...
Q:You know during that that time that he was here?
A:No he took a long a long time years all of a sudden uh my mother received news from him because he wrote a letter.
B:Oh.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:Oh really? And what did he say in that letter?
B:Uh-huh.
A:No well that he was that he was fine and if well if my mother would forgive him for the years that they did not hear from him.
Q:Oh really? Uh-huh okay and and so then when you read that letter did you decide to come to look for him also at at that during that time or did you already have...
A:Yes.
Q:Um...
A:No no because after I completed my contract in King City, California I went back to Mexico and I got contracted again and I got chosen for here uh to come in through Nogales to...
Q:To Phoenix.
A:Phoenix and there I got a surprise because I I had just gotten the news of my brother that he had that he had uh...
Q:That he had contacted them?
A:He had yes uh-huh.
Q:Okay.
A:Yes.
Q:So then you were in KingCity but you did not know that your brother had already had already...
A:No.
Q:Sent news to Mexico?
A:No...
Q:Or you did not know?
A:Because some some or I left for Mexico and some time passed. I came back and uh uh and I entered in Sept- the 7th no the yes uh-huh the 4th of September I got contracted, I arrived here in Phoenix on the 7th of September. I started to work and then I received the news about about my brother...
Q:Yes.
A:And I went about looking for him.
Q:Looking for him.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:What what were you experiences when you came to the border and the process of entering into the Bracero Program?
A:Uh um well like well it was worth it because I was able to see the northern part of of the MexicanRepublic and some other places and at the same time there was the excitement of seeing my brother and working.
Q:And working and where did you arrive you say that you arrived at Mexi- uh at Mexicali first?
A:Yes at Mexicali yes.
Q:You arrived there okay.
A:Uh-huh but then after I left a year later I came in through Nogales.
Q:Through Nogales?
A:Uh-huh.
Q:Okay.
A:Yes.
Q:Okay were your exper- were your experiences in line with your expectations?
A:Well yes.
Q:Okay.
A:Uh-huh yes that is right.
Q:And and and what is um when you arrived at the border what what did you see what did you feel when you arrived at the border? When you arrived in Mexicali when you arrived at in Nogales what did you feel?
A:Well...
Q:Did the people look just like you or did they do the same things as you or what what did what did the people do differently?
A:Uh I started to notice that well things that were unfamiliar that one is not uh is not accustomed to and...
Q:In what way?
A:Uh well seeing strange places...
Q:Yes.
A:Right? That you are not familiar with and at the same time...
Q:Uh-huh.
A:The excitement of that you were going to work to be able to earn money.
Q:And and did the people at the border dress like you? Were they dressed like you?
A:Well more more or less...
B:Uh-huh.
Q:What...
A:More or less.
Q:What what was the difference?
B:Uh-huh.
A:Well it it was not very much because first of all they they spoke Spanish and English also those that had been born here.
Q:Yes.
A:Yes and well everyone looked very good no there was a little bit more confidence...
Q:Yes.
A:In the in the same people yes.
Q:Uh-huh and the houses did they look the same as in your town?
A:No.
Q:No?
A:No they were they were very different.
Q:Okay in what way?
A:Well uh the the construction of the houses well from one from one place to another are different.
Q:In other words uh um the construction did they bri- bricks uh in the border towns and not in your town or was it the other way around?
A:Uh in my town they used another another uh type of house construction.
Q:How in what way?
A:Because there they used uh fired bricks or ado- adobe uh-huh adobe dirt also.
Q:Dirt.
A:(Inaudible).
Q:Yes okay and they did not use that in the border town?
A:Well the construction was different because there they uh it was buildings made of uh cement construction.
Q:Cement...
A:Yes.
Q:And bars?
A:Bars.
Q:Bars.
A:Yes yes uh-huh.
Q:Okay and um were there a lot of cars in your town during this this time?
A:Well no there were not a lot of cars because it rains it is a region where it rains a lot and the cars only came in during the time there was no rain.
Q:And and what what did you feel when you saw so many cars when you arrived at the border?
A:Well yes uh it was very strange because you are not used to seeing many cars.
Q:Many cars.
A:Uh-huh.
Q:And when you crossed the border were there a lot of cars there also?
A:Yes there were even more.
Q:There were more.
A:Yes.
Q:And you were not frightened?
A:Well no no no I was not frightened because we had to get used to the way of life...
Q:Yes.
A:Of the place where we were...
Q:Yes.
A:Going to to be.
Q:Okay...
A:Uh-huh.
Q:So then when you arrived where did you live?