Holiday Inn Hotel Rome

COMPOSITES Task Group

february 2008

UNCONFIRMED MINUTES

25-29 February 2008

holiday inn hotel rome

rome, italy

These minutes are not final until confirmed by the Task Group in writing or by vote at a subsequent meeting. Information herein does not constitute a communication or recommendation from the Task Group and shall not be considered as such by any agency.

MONDAY, 25 FEBRUARY 2008(CLOSED SESSION)

A Closed meeting was held with only Primes attending. Audits in Task Group and Staff Engineer Review were reviewed. The results of an Auditor Interview were discussed. Auditor statistics were reviewed to establish auditor performance since October 2007. Staff Engineer Delegation status and maintenance data was reviewed.

Action Item: Identify concerns with identification of consumable goods and address this issue via question in the audit checklist. (Lance Loeks, Kevin Dowling, Joe Dwyer) [Note: Suggested Question – Does the supplier have in place a procedure to make sure that the correct material is used?]

Action Item: Need to examine the right way to address the pump action dispensers. Audit handbook clarification needs to be developed and all references in the handbook to pump dispensers need to be aligned. (Mike Bemis, Pete Atwell, Marty Couey)

Action Item: Review data to determine how often an auditor has been paired with a facility more than once. (PRI)

MONDAY, 25 FEBRUARY 2008 (OPEN SESSION)

1.0Opening Comments

1.1Call to Order/Quorum Check

The Composites Task Group Meeting was called to order by David Watson at 2:00 pm. A quorum of qualifying members was established. 19 primes

1.1.1Introductions

1.1.2Routing of Attendance List

The attendance list was routed for signatures.

User Members Present
Name / Company
Peter / Atwell / Airbus
Mike / Bemis / Goodrich Aerostructures
Peter / Bonarrigo / Bombardier
Sharon / Bull / Rolls Royce plc
Tara / Campbell / Rolls Royce plc
David / Constable / Airbus
Jeff / Conrad / Cessna Aircraft Co.
Marty / Couey / Hawker Beechcraft
Lucia / Cutillo / Alenia Aeronautica
Marsha / Davis / Lockheed Martin
Laurent / Dejaie / Sonaca
Kevin / Dowling / Spirit AeroSystems
Joe / Dwyer / Rolls Royce
M’hamed / El Haouari / Bombardier Aerospace (Canada)
Marcel / Francois / SAFRAN Group
Angie / Gabriel / The Boeing Company
Fabio / Gasparotto / The Boeing Company - HdH
Udo / Goessler / Eurocopter
Robin / Gorman / The Boeing Company
Olivier / Goupillon / Eurocopter
Brett / Hemingway / BAE Systems
Mark / Jackson / Vought
Dennis / Keefe / GE Aviation Hamble LTD
Dr. Wolfgang / Kerfin / EADS/MAS
John / Key / Bell Helicopter Textron
Betty / Kocsis / Honeywell
Frank / Lennert / The Boeing Company
Ron / Levi / Lockheed Martin
Lance / Loeks / The Boeing Company
William / Macias / Goodrich
Leah / Markowitz / Honeywell
Luigi / Di Martino / The Boeing Company
Federico / Masellis / Alenia Aeronautica
Andreas / Mastorakis / GE Aviation
Angelina / Mendoza / Goodrich
Donald / Missel / Lockheed Martin
Keith / Panuska / Lockheed Martin
Linda / Paranthoen / Latecoere
Alberto / Portal / EADS (MTAD)
Doug / Prenovost / Northrop Grumman
Engin / Sabuncu / Cessna Aircraft Co.
Kevin / Shilling / The Boeing Company
David / Watson / Bombardier
Other Participants/Members Present
Name / Company
Stephen / Davies / Hexcel
Jean-Luc / Forget / Structil
Roger / Francombe / Advance Composites Group
Miguel / Gerdel / Thermal Structures
Dave / Gray / Mitchell Labs
Hiroki / Hashitsume / Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, LDT
Regine / Kocklenberg / Hexcel Composites
Carmela Ferentz / Kuperberg / IAI
Louis / Lagarenne / 3M Fance
Robert / Lunn / Huntsman Advance Materials
June / Mason / Albany Engineered Composites
Hitoshi / Nada / Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, LTD
Daniel / Ng / Hexcel
Krish / Patni / D-J Engineering
John / Riddell / St. Bernard Composites LTD
Don / Russell / Toray Composites
Steve / Schrameyer / Cytec Engineered Materials
Mike / Watts / GKN Aerospace Services
PRI Staff Present
Rebekah Foutz / PRI Staff (Warrendale, PA)

1.1.3Review of Agenda

The Staff Engineer (Rebekah Foutz) reviewed the agenda for this Composites Task Group,February 2008, Nadcap meeting in Rome, Italy with the Task Group members present.

1.1.4Approval of Previous Meeting Minutes

The minutes from the 22 – 26 October 2007Composites Task Group Meeting were reviewed. A motion was made for approval of the minutes, seconded, and all were in favor with no disapprovals. Therefore, the minutes were approved as written. All meeting minutes will be available on the PRI web site at

1.1.5Approval of New Voting Members

The following members were approved by the Task Group…

John Key Jr. – Bell Helicopter Textron – User Voting Member

Jamar Johnson – Bell Helicopter Textron – Alternate User Voting Member

Steve Schrameyer – Supplier Voting Member – Cytec Engineered Materials

Jeff Conrad – Cessna Aircraft Company – User Voting Member

Engin Sabuncu – Cessna Aircraft Company – Alternate User Voting Member

Tara Campbell – Rolls Royce plc – User Voting Member

2.0STAFF/AUDITOR REPORT

2.1Specific items of interest to the Composites Task Groupsince July 2007 included:

2.1.112 Primes have mandated AC7118 Rev A. A list of Primes that have mandated (Prime Matrix) Nadcap accreditation can be found on

2.1.22008 Audit Projections

• 147 Projected
• Currently 85% of the projected audits have been conducted/scheduled.
• Pareto of Nonconformances

• An updated NCR Pareto chart was presented which detailed the most recurring findings to date for Composites audits. The Paragraph in which findings were most prevalent was 11.3.2 – Are document work instructions available to operator and does the procedure(s) accurately reflect the manufacturing process?
• This presentation, including the specific questions, can be viewed on Public Documents – Composites.
• A presentation that provides additional clarification on Environmentally Monitored Areas (EMA) can also be viewed on Public Documents – Composites.
• Auditor Base Status
• The current auditor base status was presented to the Task Group. There are currently 7 auditors with one located in the Europe Sector and 5 located in the Americas Sector.
• ITAR/EAR
• 125 composite audits scheduled/conducted
• 34 (27%) have no ITAR/EAR restrictions

Action Item: The NDT Task Group has a flyer that is circulated prior to every Nadcap meeting. In that flyer they include various facts and helpful information in regards to the NDT Task Group. Determine what needs to be done to develop a similar flyer for the Composite Task Group. (PRI, Angie Mendoza, Pete Atwell, Miguel Gerdel and John Riddell)

3.0METRICS

4.1PRI presented the Composites Task Group metrics and reviewed the status of each.

• Total Supplier cycle time- Initial audits – Green

-Goal is to have an average cycle time <=34 days

-Actual average cycle time is 27

• Total Supplier cycle time – Reaccreditation audits – Green

-Goal is to have an average cycle time <=26 days

-Actual average cycle time is 20

• Staff engineer cycle time– Initial audits – Green

-Goal is to have an average cycle time <=20 days

-Actual average cycle time is 11

• Staff engineer cycle time – Reaccreditation audits – Green

-Goal is to have an average cycle time <=15 days

-Actual average cycle time is 15

• Task Group cycle time – Initial audits – Red(Staff Engineer is not Delegated for Initial Audits. Initial Audit Task Group ballots are required to be a minimum of 14 days.)

-Goal is to have an average cycle time <=7 days

-Actual average cycle time is 22

• Task Group cycle time – Reaccreditation audits – Green

-Goal is to have an average cycle time <=7 days

-Actual average cycle time is 7

• Suppliers on merit – Red

-Goal is to have 80% of Suppliers eligible, on Merit

-Actual percentage is 65%

• Prime Audit Balloting charts presented for initial and reaccreditation

4.0SUPPLIER SUPPORT COMMITTEE REPORT – (MIGUEL GERDEL)

The Nadcap Supplier Support Committee (SSC) update was presented, including the mission and purpose of this committee. An update was given on the activities of the Communications and Mentoring Team, Metrics Team, Supplier Survey Team, 25 Mile Rule and Pilot Checklist Review. Further details on these topics can be reviewed in the attached SSC Report.

The minutes from the SSC meeting conducted on Tuesday, 23October 2007 will be available on

5.0ACTION ITEM LIST REPORT OUT

The action items from the previous meetings were reviewed during the meeting as follows:

4.2Action Item Status

• October Action Item #1 – See Agenda Item #6.
• October Action Item #2 – Closed – Audit Handbook clarification revised.
• October Action Item #3 – Open – Will discuss during a Task Group conference call prior to next Nadcap meeting.
• October Action Item #4 – Closed – Audit Handbook Clarification revised.
• October Action Item #5 – Open – Will discuss during a Task Group conference call prior to next Nadcap meeting.
• October Action Item #6 -7 – Closed
• October Action Item #8 – Open – Will discuss during a Task Group conference call prior to next Nadcap meeting.
• October Action Item #9 – Closed – Audit Handbook clarification revised.
• October Action Item #10 – Open – Will discuss during a Task Group conference call prior to next Nadcap meeting.
• October Action Items #11-15 – Closed

6.0AC7118 – REVIEW OF SECTION 3 – 11 (ACTION ITEM #1)

A team of Task Group members were assigned the action item to review sections 3 - 11 of the AC7118 Rev A to determine if there is duplication between these sections and the job audits (sections 12 – 23). The team provided feedback on their results. There were a number of questions identified therefore the Task Group agreed that the originally assigned sub-team would continue to work on the questions until the end of June. At that time the questions will be circulated to the entire Task Group to collect comments. Those questions that were commented on would then be reviewed at the July Nadcap meeting. Any question that was not commented on will not be discussed.

Action Item: The original sub-team is to continue their work on the identified questions. (Lance Loeks (lead), Miguel Gerdel, Kevin Dowling, Dave Tomasitis, Dave Kimber, Pete Atwell and June Mason)

Action Item: Circulate the final proposal to the Task Group to gather comments that will be discussed at the July Nadcap meeting. (PRI)

TUESDAY, 26 FEBRUARY 2008(CLOSED SESSION)

A Closed meeting was held with only Primes attending. During this time the following items were addressed…Audits in Task Group and Staff Engineer Review were reviewed and discussed. A succession plan for the Task Group Chair, Vice Chair and Secretary was reviewed and approved (See attached presentation for details.). Auditor statistics were reviewed to establish auditor performance since July 2007. Staff Engineer Delegation status and maintenance data was reviewed. Some concern was expressed that the Task Group required AS9100 training for the Composite Staff Engineer has not been completed.

Action Item: Direct the Auditors to provide further detail of the audit status in their audit cover letter. Auditors will be asked to detail how many times they have audited that specific Supplier (e.g. “This is my second time at Supplier B.”). (PRI)

TUESDAY, 26 FEBRUARY 2008(OPEN SESSION)

7.0JULY AUDITOR TRAINING – FINALIZE TOPICS

8.0JULY AUDITOR TRAINING – WORKING SESSIONS

These topics were set aside for a Task Group conference call to be scheduled at a later date. More pressing topics that were brought forward during the meeting were asked to be added to the Open Discussion (agenda item 9), thus required additional time in the agenda.

9.0OPEN DISCUSSION

9.1NTGOP-001 Ballot Recall

9.1.1Some concern was expressed over the proposed changes to the NTGOP-001 that were circulated and then later recalled prior to the February Nadcap meeting. The main concern expressed by the Task Group was that Task Groups will not be required to be included in formal ballots of the NOPs that, in the near future, will contain all of the Supplier Merit, Audit Failure and Staff Engineer Delegation criteria.

9.1.2It was reiterated that any and all concerns with any documents that are balloted to NMC, need to be expressed to the respective NMC representatives.

9.2CCA and EMA Concerns

9.2.1A Supplier expressed concern that the Audit Handbook does not allow the use of equipment that utilizes lubricant in the clean room. It was clarified that there are a few situations where this could be necessary.

Action Item: Look into a possible change to the Audit Handbook Clarification for CCA and EMA to clarify situations such as this. (John Riddell, Miguel Gerdel, Lance Loeks, Pete Atwell, Kevin Dowling)

9.3Storage of Materials in Freezers

9.3.1AC7118 Rev A, paragraph 6.1.3 reads, “Is there a record that monitors the materials stored in the cold storage unit(s) including their product designation and expiration date?” There was question as to what was required for a record. Audit handbook clarification was revised for this question to make the intent of the question clear.

Action Item: Clarify to Auditors the intent of paragraph 6.1.3. (PRI)

9.1Identification of Consumable Materials

9.1.1Audit Handbook was revised to specify that labels are not required if the supplier can demonstrate they are using expendable materials as defined by the customer or internal procedure.

10.0MEETING CLOSE OUT

10.1Next meeting date and location

The next Nadcap meetings are scheduled for the week of 21 – 25 July 2008 in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.

Composite session will be scheduled Open all day Monday, Tuesday Closed for two hours in morning and the Open for the rest of the day. Wednesday will be Open and both Composite and Non Metallic Materials participants are encouraged to attend. Wednesday afternoon through Friday will be dedicated to Non Metallic Materials. The formal agenda will be developed, distributed and will be available on

ADJOURNMENT – The meeting was adjourned at 3:50p.m.

WEDNESDAY, 27 FBRUARY 2008 (OPEN SESSION)

Non Metallic Materials (NMM) Sub-Group

1.0Opening Comments

1.1Call to Order/Quorum Check

The Composites Task Group Meeting was called to order by David Watson at 11:20a.m. A quorum of qualifying members was established.

1.2Introductions

1.3Routing of Attendance List

The attendance list was routed for signatures

2.0HISTORY AND BACKGROUND OF PCD AC DEvelopmenT

2.1The history and background of the development of AC7124 was discussed to update all in attendance on the progress of the development of the audit criteria and direction the group is heading in.

2.2Primes in attendance agreed to organize a letter or intent to mandate that would be circulated to all applicable Suppliers.

3.0ACTION ITEM REPORT OUT

The action items from the previous meetings were reviewed during the meeting as follows:

3.1Action Item Status

• October Action Item #2 – Closed
• October Action Item #3 – Slides will be added and Open and Closing Meeting Presentation will be circulated to Auditors
• October Action Item #8-9 – Closed
• October Action Item #15-20 – Closed
• October Action Item #21-23 – Closed – These were reviewed during Thursday, Agenda Item #4.
• October Action Items #1, 4-7 and 10-14 were reviewed on Friday.

4.0AUDIT CRITERIA DEVELOPMENT FOR AC7124

4.1The scope of the AC7124 was outlined. Specific checklist questions were then developed.

AC7124 – Raw Material Manufacturing

General Requirements

• Raw Material Control – (See Receiving Job Audits AC7118 Rev A)
• Receiving
• Storage and Handling
• Shelf life control
• Process Change Management
• Quality System Requirements

AC7124/1 – Prepreg

Job Audits

• Receiving – Reinforcement
• Receiving – Resin
• Prepregging – Hot Melt (film offline)
• Prepregging – Hot Melt (film online)
• Prepregging – Solution (tow, uni tape or fabric)
• Slitting (Prepreg or film)
• Slitting – Automated fiber placement (AFP)
• Re-winding
• Plying
• Packaging
• Storage
• Certification

AC7124/2 – Resin

Job Audits

• Receiving – Constituent 1
• Receiving – Constituent 2
• Mixing – Compounding
• Mixing – Reactor Mixing
• Mixing – In-Line Mixing/Continuous Mixing
• Blending

THURSDAY, 28 FEBRUARY 2008 (OPEN SESSION)

4.0AUDIT CRITERIA DEVELOPMENT FOR AC7124 – CONTINUED

4.1The results of Action Items 21 through 23 were reviewed and teams were formed to continue development of the AC7124. The draft checklists will be sent out for ballot once they are written and organized. Open conference calls and potential meetings will be held to continue the development of these checklists. Further review will take place at the next Nadcap meeting.

Action Item – Develop Audit Criteria for AC7124/1 – Prepreg specifically for Prepregging – Hot Melt (film offline). Mid May. (Don Russell and Angie Gabriel (lead))

Action Item – Develop Audit Criteria for AC7124/1 – Prepreg specifically for Prepregging – Hot Melt (file online). End of May. (Pete Atwell (lead), David Constable and Roger Francombe)

Action Item – Develop Audit Criteria for AC7124/1 – Prepreg specifically for Prepregging – Solution (tow, uni tape or fabric). (Mike Bemis and Angie Gabriel)

Action Item – Develop Audit Criteria for AC7124/1 – Prepreg specifically for Slitting (Prepreg or film). (John Key, Jeff Conrad and Steve Schrameyer)

Action Item – Develop Audit Criteria for AC7124/1 – Prepreg specifically for Slitting – Automated fiber placement (AFP). Mid June. (Mike Bemis)

Action Item – Develop Audit Criteria for AC7124/1 – Prepreg specifically for Plying. (John Key)

Action Item – Develop Audit Criteria for AC7124/2 – Resin specifically for Mixing – Compounding and Mixing – Reactor Mixing. Mid May. (Mike Bemis and Andreas Mastorakis)

Action Item – Develop Audit Criteria for AC7124/2 – Resin specifically for Mixing – In-Line Mixing/Continuous Mixing. Mid May. (Mike Bemis (lead), Steve Schrameyer, David Constable, Pete Atwell and Brett Hemingway)

Action Item – Develop Audit Criteria for AC7124/2 – Resin specifically for Blending. Mid June. (Andreas Mastorakis (lead) and Steve Schrameyer)

Action Item – Schedule a conference call in mid May, End of May and mid June to discuss and review the status of the audit criteria development for AC7124. (PRI)

5.0OPEN DISCUSSION

No topics were brought forward for discussion.

6.0MEETING CLOSE OUT

6.1Next meeting date and location

The next Nadcap meetings are scheduled for the week of 21 – 25 July 2008 in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.

Composite session will be scheduled Open all day Monday, Tuesday Closed for two hours in morning and the Open for the rest of the day. Wednesday will be Open and both Composite and Non Metallic Materials participants are encouraged to attend. Wednesday afternoon through Friday will be dedicated to Non Metallic Materials. The formal agenda will be developed, distributed and will be available on