FIRE AND AVIATION LEADERSHIP MEETING
November 16, 2005
Jim Kenna delivered the opening remarks.
Agenda:
FS National Fire Information / New Doctrine Tom Harbour
BLM National Fire Information Tom Boatner
ISO Update Doug Nash
Mike Field
Mike Andler
Vertex Radio Replacement
ISO / Fire Mgmt. Communication Protocol
Replacement schedules / Radio-over IP
Severity 1 vs. Level 1 EUSC Tickets
Narrow Band / Wide Band Issues
Tom Harbour:
· There will be new doctrine coming out of the Pulaski Conference.
· Forest Service budget is declining or will be flat for the foreseeable future.
· Training for “other than fire” assignments is not addressed in 5109.17.
· Forest Service will continue to use the 5109.17. Does not want employees to train so much for the “other than fire” assignments that “we” lose the connection with the land, the forests, the woods.
· In 2005 thirty seven percent of the assignments were for “other than fire” assignments.
Tom Boatner:
· Reviewed the fire season and hurricane season as the representative of NMAC. If anyone has concerns about how NMAC or GMAC are operating, let Karyn Wood, Steve Dickenson, or Leo Sidbotham know because they are attending the annual NMAC / GMAC meeting.
· The buying power of preparedness budget in BLM is reducing about 6% per year for the next three or four years. The top priority from Boise is getting the firefighters on the ground, although there are a lot of other expenses that have to be paid. They have proposed the cutting of exclusive use aviation contracts to be able to put more firefighters on the ground.
· Radio system communications are ‘bad.’ Part of the problem is the complicated hand-held and complicated narrow band radio in the aircraft. There is an Area Command team addressing on the issue. Contractors use part of the equation in radio use. Professor working on a website with diagrams and illustrations to assist in programming radios. Tom Boatner will furnish the website address.
· NMAC addressed the team size issue in the spring, and there were a lot of negative responses. The IOS working team is going to make a recommendation regarding the team size including trainees.
· There have been questions regarding liability in light of the Cramer Issue. DOI is trying to change the law so that fire people performing as an IC or DIVS on incidents can be cover for half of the premiums of liability insurance. Qualifying employees will be based on their leadership position in their ICS position, if they are not a leader in their position off of the incident.
· The Pacific Northwest has put a large effort into the management and standards of the contracting industry. Other regions are copying the Pacific Northwest’s methods.
· Appears to be a gap between the excellent leaders now who are in a position to be retiring in the near future and the young employees that are ‘training’ to be leaders in the future.
· Potential move of BLM NIFC staff to Washington DC – there are pros and cons to the move. The Director would like to see more of the Fire Staff in Washington DC to help her deal with issues.
ISO Update Doug Nash
Mike Field
Mike Andler
Frank Newman
Vertex Radio Replacement
ISO / Fire Mgmt. Communication Protocol
Replacement schedules / Radio-over IP
Severity 1 vs. Level 1 EUSC Tickets
Narrow Band / Wide Band Issues
Forest Service issue. No decision has been made. Gathering information to make decision.
There are about 10,000 contract employees in the Pacific Northwest – sizeable workforce.
There are two issues related to the Vertex radios – the training and the programming.
BLM had made the decision to replace the Raycals with Bendix Kings. Recommendation the Forest Service use Bendix Kings.
Problems identified from FALT:
· When someone goes out of region, no one can program the radio.
· The protocols are different on forests and within the region.
· The user group is huge; it is interagency, states, counties, contractors. The Forest Service and BLM should be on the same page.
· The Gifford-Pinchot, Mt. Baker-Snoqualmie and Olympic radios are scheduled to be replaced in FY2007.
· No process has currently been distributed to solicit input from the customer, but ISO will send it out.
· If Region 6 has a value of having one system for radios between the Forest Service and BLM, the ISO would be responsive to that. They would scope it out to find out what would meet their needs, how much it would cost, etc.
· If something is not happening the way it should, they should go to Mike Andler first, then Mike Field and then Doug Nash, or if they cannot contact someone, they can contact any of the three.
· Go broke with training program, should be one size fits all.
· Need a clear understanding of what decisions we can influence, and what is our decision space.
· How are decisions made in the ISO?
· Difference between Level I and Severity I
· Get outside of ISO and include cooperators
· One national standard for radios for federal agencies, one brand of radio
· Fix on current Vertex for scan mode
· Given a date for change over from wide band to narrow band, and concern is our cooperators will not be with us.
· Clear understanding if we cannot have one standard radio, how does safety fit into this, when and where does safety overrule?
· Communication aspect – who is ISO communicating with? They need to make sure the information is getting out there.
· Support for expanded dispatch. Umpqua does not have a date or plan to switch to narrow band. There is no backup system on the Umpqua.
· Being responsive 24-7 during fire season.
· This is a safety concern and complexity on an incident and not a training issue. Standardization and safety.
· BLM still has radio techs but they cannot work on Forest Service equipment because there are not agreements in place.
· Standardization – Training will not solve this. There are employees on the Willamette that carry two radios around so they can communicate.
· Radio consoles tied with T-1 phones lines and then the lines going down. There is not a back-up. Two different agencies repeaters on the same mountain top.
· Scanning handhelds and mobiles is a big issues.
· Is training being coordinated through NMAC? Incredible system slow downs in the Forest Service and when they call the Help Desk, they point to others.
· Lose of trust in being able to communicate.
· Provide tools to people and train them to use the tools. We aren’t capable of programming the radios now. Software and hardware problems.
· Radios customer service groups – nation-wide there needs to be a group to address needs.
· Voice-over technology has some problems, the older voice-over technology was better.
· Frequencies issues between the Umatilla and Malheur, frequency conflicts. Back-up systems is Dispatch, continuous of operations, consistency / uniformity across the board.
· 9-11 Commission had a report on the communications and how they may have contributed to deaths of some firefighters. There is too much training provided now.
· More relaxed process in communicating with ISO, not necessarily with the Help Desk.
· Fremont / Winema still trying to fix the system and may have these problems until it is replaced.
· Go to standard radio for agencies. Have to a liaison or contract for the replacements. Lacking Forest Service representative on FY06 program of work.
· Don’t leave private contractor out of the solution.
· Other radios cannot do what the King can. Confusion on what the user group is supposed to come up with. Everyone has to be included – Forest Service, BLM, rurals, states, etc.
· Standardization. BLM has gone back to Kings, after trying Raycals.
· If it takes legislation to make this possible, maybe legislation needs to be changed.
· Standardization is for the handheld radio, as well as mobiles, dispatch consoles, etc.
The ISO group will get answers back to the group on the questions that were asked.
Ken or Carl will be the point of contract for the ISO group.