TALKING POINTS for Facilitators of Community Conversations- IMMIGRATION MYTHS (ROP 1-08)

FACILITATORS: Opening Points

This is a conversation among this group on a current day hot topic – immigration. Our intent is to create space for folks to share what you are hearing and struggling with – put it out there in a way that we can try and separate out facts from myths. Right now there is a lot of information flying around out there about immigration and we are concerned with how the current tenor of this debate has become pretty mean-spirited. So, what is real? What is hype? What is confusing? What do we need more information on?
This event is designed for the community to take some time to discuss this issue together. There is no easy solution or single way to look at immigration issues. There are a lot of aspects to it and so we will all have different opinions about this. The point of this conversation is for us to have a respectful talk that opens up the space for us all to talk about this. We will leave here with many issues unresolved but we may also leave here with more clarity and with tools for continuing this much needed discussion at our dinner tables, book groups and town halls. Tough topics require tough conversations and lots of them. But they always do better if we also practice some basic groundrules of civil discourse. Speak your truth but then listen for the truth in other’s perspectives.
The main ground rule I want to emphasize is that we want this to be a respectful conversation. While many of us may have some pretty strong feelings about these issues, it won’t be helpful to our discussion for speakers to attack each other. Let’s assume that we all come to this conversation in good faith and each of us deserves basic respect, even if we disagree.
I bet there will be some of us that have a lot to say and some of us that are less likely to talk a lot. I will be leading this conversation in a way that gives everyone a chance to speak. If you do have a lot to say I ask that you pay attention to that and sometimes hold your comment to allow other folks to speak up. If you go on for too long, I might need to jump in and cut you off since our time is limited. I will also be calling on folks in a way that allows for everyone to participate.
Can everyone here agree to these groundrules? (Be respectful and limit your comments or expect me to step in!)
My role is to create a space for us to have this conversation in the framework of our values of democracy and human dignity. At the end of the conversation for those that are interested, I will share information about ways that my organization, Rural Organizing Project, is taking action.
I will be sharing a statement or question that is related to immigration and then we will all talk about it. I have quite a few questions here and we will have about 5-6 minutes for each one. While I want to allow the space for us to talk, I will also be moving us along to get through these.

FACILITATOR Notes

Share a statement and then allow for people to comment. It may be that for the first question or two it will require some encouragement to get anyone to speak. Be sure to give enough space and prodding to get folks talking. If someone brings up a point that might feel hard to digest, ask them a question back. After a few people have commented, share the core point about this question that is listed below if it has not already been brought up.
Don’t be afraid to cut people off if they are rambling on or taking up a lot of space. Don’t be afraid to not call on someone if they are speaking a lot. (And by sharing that point at the beginning folks will accept this). There will be more vocal people in the room. Be sure to keep the benefit of the whole conversation in mind and make decisions on who should have a turn to talk based on that. Try to make sure everyone has a chance to speak – this is a conversation not a lecture from a few people!
You will probably not have time to go through every statement so choose based on your sense of where the group is focused. Try to anticipate what the key issues are for this group of participants in this particular community. Often, the issues covered in another statement will come up in discussion of a related statement. Follow the comments closely and then choose statements accordingly.

Statements and Responses

1. It would be fine to have immigrants here but they are using up all of our social services.

On a federal level, undocumented immigrants are ineligible for all federal benefits. Almost all documented immigrants arriving after August 1996 are ineligible for Food Stamps, Medicaid, Temporary Assistance to Needy Families (TANF or welfare), and Supplemental Security Income (SSI) for at least five years. The fact that there has been no decrease in immigration since the passage of the 1996 laws shows that immigrants do not come to this country to access public benefits.
Undocumented workers are ineligible for the Oregon Health Plan (except for life-threatening emergency care), food stamps, and temporary cash assistance. If their children are U.S. citizens, the children may be eligible for these program, but the benefits are reduced to exclude anyone who is inelible in the household. All children in Oregon may attend public school. At the same time, undocumented workers contribute substantially to Oregon's economy, through their labor, purchases, and taxes.
Emergency medicine (the ER) is the only healthcare that someone can receive if they do not have health insurance.
Education: most education costs are paid by property and state income taxes. If you are working, you are paying state income taxes. And even renters pay property taxes because landowners factor that into their rent.

2. But immigrants don’t pay taxes!

Immigrants pay taxes, in the form of income, property, sales, and taxes at the federal and state level. As far as income tax payments go, sources vary in their accounts, but a range of studies find that immigrants pay between $90 and $140 billion a year in federal, state, and local taxes. Undocumented immigrants pay income taxes as well, as evidenced by the Social Security Administrations suspense file (taxes that cannot be matched to workers names and social security numbers), which grew by $20 billion between 1990and 1998. These taxes go do pay for benefits that the worker can never receive, thereby subsidizing the Social Security Trust Fund to the benefit of the rest of us.
Some immigrants work off the books—as do some U.S. citizens—and may avoid taxes by doing so. Best estimate seems to be that about 70 % of undocumented workers have taxes deducted from payroll. Often, they do not claim refunds for excess taxes withheld to which they are entitled.
Income taxes still get paid even without a correct social security number. When taxes are paid on a social security # that is not correct, the employer gets a letter being notified of the incorrect number. The employer either gets the correct ss # or indicates that the taxes should be paid into 000-00-0000.
In Oregon, undocumented immigrants contribute annually to Oregon between $66 million and $77 million in property taxes, state income taxes, and excise taxes. Undocumented immigrant workers in Oregon pay between $58 million and $67 million annually in Social Security taxes, which is matched with employer contributions, and another $13 million to $16 million annually in Medicare taxes that are also matched by employer contributions.
Undocumented workers are an important part of Oregon's economy. The work they perform is vital in certain industries, like agriculture and nursery work. In addition, a substantial portion of the roughly $2 billion they earn in income each year is spent on goods, services, and taxes in Oregon, to the benefit of the state economy.

3. It’s fine for immigrants to come here but what is really frustrating is that they don’t learn English.

There are English as a second language classes but usually they are over-subscribed and have long waiting lines.
How many of you have studied a second language? (wait for hands to go up) Now, how many of you are fluent in that second language? (note how few hands are still up). It’s extremely difficult to learn a second language as an adult.
There is no danger of English losing dominance within the US. Within 10 years of arrival, 76 percent of first generation immigrants speak English “well” or “very well”. Most third generation grandchildren of Latino immigrants do not speak Spanish at more than a rudimentary level.
Offering services and education in multiple languages does not prevent immigrants from learning English; rather it enables them to more quickly learn English and gain the educational and job skills that will make them valuable to our economy and engaged citizens.

4. It’s illegal immigrants that are the problem. I am fine with legal immigrants, but people who come here illegally are breaking the law and they should be punished. Why don’t they just wait in line for their turn?

There is no line (unless you are a highly skilled professional or have family member here who is a citizen). How many of you are doctors or engineers? The process for coming here legally is difficult, expensive, and impossible for most people.
If you are the brother of a citizen right now it will take you 55 years to get through the immigration process (depending on what country you are from).
If you do have a citizen relative you must show you can support yourself at 125% above the poverty line. You must have a job or that person must be able to prove that they can support you and be willing to sign a binding contract saying they will be responsible for any needs you have.
There is a tendency in the anti-immigrant movement historically as well as today to use language and images that dehumanize immigrants. This happened in cartoons that depicted Chinese-American workers in the 1800s and it is true today on anti-immigrant blogs that refer to Mexicans as cockroaches or an infestation. A less extreme example of this is the use of the words “alien” and “illegal”. We don’t call someone an illegal person when they break the law by cheating the IRS or an illegal driver when they run a red light. Undocumented/unauthorized immigrants aren’t little green men from Mars; they are our neighbors. That humanity gets lost when we talk about illegal aliens.

5. If the Government just enforced the law, then we wouldn’t have a problem.

According to the NY Times, the projected cost for rounding up and deporting all the undocumented immigrants is estimated at $74 billion.
This doesn’t include the costs that this will have on our civil liberties, on the tranquility of our communities, and what this would mean for all the children of immigrants who are citizens.
Local law enforcement officers are not trained in immigration enforcement because it would compromise their primary mission: to ensure the safety of our communities. The effectiveness of local law enforcement depends on community trust. If the police asked every victim of a crime for immigration papers, immigrant victims would cease to report crimes, making them easy targets, increasing the overall crime rate, and putting every Oregonian at greater risk.

6. What about terrorism? We need to control our border. Aren’t we just setting ourselves up for a terrorist attack?

The only terrorist caught entering the US came in through Canada. Canada has a more lax immigration system. In Mexico it’s tighter. There is much greater scrutiny on the Mexican border. Anyone meaning to do us harm would be crazy to try to come across the Mexican border.
No matter how much we try to block off the border, people will come here from Mexico for jobs. And the way they will get here, especially as it is more and more difficult to get across is by paying a coyote. By not having a system to allow people to come here legally, we are encouraging this alternative system. Created and supported to allow farm workers and janitors to come here to work, this is a system that terrorists could then tap into; they just have to pay enough money and a coyote would bring them over.
If we had a better system to meet the need of people coming in then we could actually keep track of who is coming in.
Funding for border enforcement has increased ten-fold over the last 20 years and the number of border agents has quadrupled, with no corresponding decline in illegal immigration. Economic migrants are forced to cross in more remote parts of the border, lowering apprehension rates and tripling death rates (Cato Institute). Both President Bush and the Secretary of the Department of Homeland Security agree that effective border control depends on creating new legal channels for hardworking immigrant families.

7. Illegal immigrants undercut wages of other workers.

There have been studies to compare cities like LA or Miami (with a high level of immigrants) and those like Cleveland (with a low level of immigrants) . We can’t know if this is because of immigrants, but what the studies have shown is that the economies of immigrant rich cities have had much more robust economies. Immigrants are not just workers; they are also consumers. They tend to start more small businesses than the native population and this creates jobs and generates more business to fill the need for more equipment, materials, real estate, etc. to support these businesses.
If you are a union worker, in order to have bargaining power and strength you want every single worker to join your union. It is just a fact that, in many industries, a significant part of the work force is undocumented. If you have a class of workers who do not have effective legal protections, you won’t have the same strength or power as a union. Organizing all workers on a job site or in a field of work, including undocumented immigrants, means that everyone makes the union wage and there is not an underclass that is forced by vulnerability to undercut union wages. But to do this, all workers must have legal protections.
Real frustrations about lack of employment and job security are used to scapegoat immigrants instead of placing the blame on big international corporations and US global economic policy that promotes hiring low wage workers outside of the US where there are only limited labor and environmental controls that are considered removable “barriers to free trade.” Corporations that relocate to sites with cheaper labor cause a loss of unionized jobs.
Globalization and trade policies created by the WTO and programs imposed by the World Bank and IMF have actually contributed to immigration by creating and sustaining much of the poverty in developing countries. Immigrants do not set immigration or economic policies, but when there are problems or shortcomings with these policies, it is immigrants who are scapegoated and blamed, not the governments and business interests that create the policies in the first place. Example of corn value in Mexico.
Many studies have documented the economic contributions of immigrant labor to the US economy, including human capitol, a mobile workforce that can respond to tight labor markets, a willingness to work less desirable jobs.

8. What about temporary worker programs? Can’t those fill our needs for workers?

This creates a subservient class of workers. If you stand up and demand fair treatment, your employer could just send you back or not hire you next time.
When former Congressperson Elizabeth Furse from Oregon heard about this program she said that it was just like apartheid. She was an immigrant from Zimbabwe. Her mother had been run out of South Africa for opposing apartheid. She explained that the economic structure of apartheid involved allowing African workers from the Bantustans to come temporarily to Johannesburg to work in the mines, but banning them from bringing families, settling permanently or gaining rights of citizenship. Just like apartheid, temporary worker programs rely on the labor of a subservient group of people who do the work to keep the country alive, but are not granted full rights and benefits as citizens of that country. So we have to ask ourselves, can this solution work practically as well as what is the moral cost of this policy? (Source of this information: Michael Dale, immigration lawyer who visited Congresswoman First to discuss the temporary worker programs).

9. Some people say those who oppose illegal immigration are racist. It doesn’t have anything to do with race, it’s about following the law.

There are links among leadership in the anti-immigrant movement to the White Supremacist movement. For example, Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR) has accepted more than $1 million from the Pioneer Fund, a foundation created in 1937 to promote ‘racial betterment’ through eugenics. After working to popularize ‘Applied Genetics in Present-Day Germany’ – the Nazis Lebensborn and forced sterilization program – Pioneer broadened its focus to support restrictive immigration policies, anti-busing activities, and research into ‘racial’ differences in intelligence. In the 1980s it financed a publication glorifying the founder of the KKK. (Crawford, 1992a). The Southern Poverty Law Center labels Federation for American Immigration Reform, Border Guardians, and other groups as hate groups.
Racist hate activity has increased as anti-immigrant rhetoric has increased. According to the FBI 2007 research hate crimes increased about 8% in 2006 and anti-Latino hate activity increased approximately 35% between 2003 and 2006.
Max Blumenthal, a journalist with The Nation wrote: They [the Minutemen] come from the white nationalist movement, a movement that seeks to maintain what they consider the white character of the United States. David Duke, the former Ku Klux Klan leader, said, “You know, people called me crazy then for what I said about immigration, but I sound like every Republican today, and a lot of Democrats, and no one gives me any credit for that. And not only that, I conducted the first civilian border patrol.” Indeed, in 1979 David Duke drove around in a car marked “Klan Border Watch” looking for undocumented immigrants on the border, and he was pursued by about forty reporters. This was an enormous PR coup for the Ku Klux Klan, and it’s been copied by grassroots pressure groups like the Minutemen, who -- they're adopting specifically a white nationalist strategy from the Ku Klux Klan…And this movement is growing more extreme at the grassroots, at the same time more influential in the mainstream.

ASK: WHAT OTHER QUESTIONS ARE PEOPLE STRUGGLING WITH? We can’t get to all of them but let’s see if we can think together on some of these. (Other questions you might hear include the following. Feel free to say that you don’t know or will get back to people on questions that you can’t answer and then let know so that ROP can follow up. Don’t make up information! It may be helpful to refer to ROP’s framework for talking about immigration issues. )