Concerning the Holy , Its Testability

PLATO

EUTHYPHRON



[

[Concerning The Holy , Its Testability]



The Characters of The Dialogue



EUTHYPHRON , SOCRATES

Euthyphro: 1 What strange new thing , O Socrates , has happened , that you have left your



accustomed way of life there in the Lyceum and are now accustoming yourself to the colonnade



of the king ? For surely , it cannot be that you are indeed also suing anyone before the king , 

just as I happen to be doing .



Socrates: These Athenians certainly , O Euthyphro , do not indeed call it a private lawsuit ,



by a public prosecution .



Euthyphro: What are you saying ? Has somebody then , written an indictment against you ,



as it is likely ? For I do not recognize you at all , as having brought one against another .

b

Socrates: Most certainly not .



Euthyphro: But someone else against you ?



Socrates: By all means indeed .



Euthyphro: Who is this person ? ( ;)

Socrates: I do not recognize the gentleman himself at all , O Euthyphro , for to me he appears to

’

to be a young and unknown person . His name however , is Meletus , I believe . And he is



of the tribe of Pytheus , if you happen to remember a certain Pythian Meletus , having long hair 

and hardly any beard , and an aquiline nose .



Euthyphro: I cannot bring him to mind , O Socrates ; but what sort of judicial process

c

has he indeed brought against you ?



Socrates: What sort ? No ignoble one , as it appears to me at least ; for the fact that , as young 

as he is , he has recognized so important a Business , is no thoughtless accomplishment . Because



of that , as he says , he knows , how the youth are first corrupted and who those are who 

corrupt them . And he is likely to be a wise man ; who , looking down on my unenlightened state

as contributing to the corruption of his fellows , comes to the administrators of the city , as if to



his mother , to accuse me . And he seems to me to be the only one of the politicians who begins



in the right way ; for the right way is , to take care of the young men first , so as to make them

d 

as good as possible , just as a Good Gardener will naturally take care of the young shoots first ,



but then after these , all of the others . And certainly Meletus , similarly , is first on the one hand , 

also clearing away those of us who corrupt the tender offspring , as he says ; then after this ,



when he has turned his careful attention to the older men , clearly , he will be The Cause



of Plenteous and Great Goods for the city , as should indeed be , the natural outcome

 

out of such a beginning .



Euthyphro: 2 I wish it were so , O Socrates ; but I shudder to think , the opposite will result .

’

For it seems to me that he absolutely begins by injuring the city at its very heart [hearth] ,

’

by taking in hand , to harm you !

  .

Cratylus

Hermogenes : And on the one hand , O Socrates , you certainly appear to me to be absolutely

d

prophetic indeed , just as those suddenly inspired .



Socrates : 15 And I attribute this , most certainly indeed , O Hermogenes , to have come over me



from Euthyphro the Prospaltian . For I was with him and listened to him a long time , early this morning .



So it is likely I have been inspired , for he , not only filled my ears with spiritual wisdom



but he also took possession of my very soul .



It appears that Euthyphro was of the right opinion that Meletus was indeed attacking The Luminous Heart of the city , just as Anytos, one of the witnesses against Socrates , was also of the right opinion that sophists were “a manifest plague and cancer” upon the city [Meno 91c] . Yet the dream-like quality of right opinion does nothing to round-out into a soundminded trust , that which , should not be an end in itself : opinion : belief . For Euthyphro, on the one hand, does not directly recognize , that which makes the philosopher ; Socrates , The Luminous Heart of the city , nor does Anytos , on the other hand , directly recognize , that which makes sophists a manifest cancer upon the city . JFB

Now tell me , and what does he say you do , to corrupt the young ?



Socrates: Absurd notions indeed , O wonderful friend , at hearing them . For proclaims me to be

b ’ 

a “maker of gods” and because “I make new gods” , I do not believe in “the ones of old” ,



thus he indicted me for the sake of these old ones themselves , as he says .

’

Euthyphro: I understand , O Socrates ! It is certainly because you say that The Holy Spirit



has come to be Ever-present with you . So he has written up this indictment against you for



“making innovations in divination ” , and he is going into court so as to slander you ,



knowing that slanders on such subjects are readily accepted by the multitude .



For they also ridicule me as being mad , when I say anything in the assembly about

c  

matters on divination , foretelling future events to them . And yet there is not one of these things



which I have foretold , that has not proven true ; but , they are equally ill-disposed to all such men

’

as us . However , we must not pay any attention to them , but we must continue in our own way .

’’



Socrates: 3 O my dear Euthyphro , but their ridicule on the one hand , perhaps , does not matter .



For the Athenians , as I suspect , do not much care , if they should imagine someone is devious ,



provided that he does not teach his wisdom to others ; but on the other hand , should they imagine

’

that he also makes others to be such as himself , then they get angry , either through ill-will ,

’’

as you say , or through something else .

e

Euthyphro: In view of this , then , I do not at all desire to test their sentiments toward me , ever .



Socrates: Thus perhaps , in your case , you show yourself but rarely and are unwilling



to impart and teach your wisdom . But in my case , I fear , that because of my love of mankind



I appear , not only to pour myself out copiously to them and to all men , without any payment ,



but that I , would even pay , if anyone would be willing to listen to what I have to say .



So if on the one hand , as I was saying just now , they were to laugh at me , just as you say

e 

they do at you , it would not be at all unpleasant to pass the time in the court with jests and



laughter ; but if they are serious , then forthwith , in what manner this matter will turn out

’

is unclear , except to you , the inspired .



Euthyphro: But perhaps this business will come to nothing , O Socrates ,

’

and you will fight your case according to Mind , as I shall mine , as I imagine .



Socrates: 4 What then is your case indeed ,O Euthyphro ? Are you defending or prosecuting ?



Euthyphro: Prosecuting .(

Socrates: Whom ? (

Euthyphro: Such a man , that I in turn appear to be mad because I am prosecuting him .



Socrates: Why then ? Are you prosecuting someone who has wings to fly ?



Euthyphro: He is necessarily far from flying indeed , for he happens to be at a ripe old age .



Socrates: Who is this person ?



Euthyphro: My father .



Socrates: O my very good man , your very own father ?



Euthyphro: By all means , indeed .



Socrates: But what is the charge , and what is this suit about ?



Euthyphro: Manslaughter , Socrates .



Socrates: Heracles ! Truly ? By what Right , O Euthyphro ? Being that most people are ignorant



in what manner Righteousness exists at any given time . For I suspect , it is not the multitude ,



those who are indeed able to hit The Mark Itself , In the Right Way ,



but certainly only One who has already Struck The Very Center of Wisdom .



Euthyphro: Certainly , very far indeed , O Socrates , by God .



Socrates: Certainly then , the one who was killed by your father is a relative ? Clearly he was !

 

For surely you would not bring a charge of manslaughter against him on account of a stranger .



Euthyphro: It is ridiculous , O Socrates , that you think that there is any difference , either when



the person killed was a stranger or a relative , but do not see that this alone must be guarded- ’

-against ; whether in the act of slaying the slayer acted justly or not , and that if on the one hand ,

-

it was justified , then one should let him be , but if on the other hand he was not , then one should 

proceed against him , even if the slayer as much as shares your hearth and table . For the pollution 

comes to be equally the same , if you associate knowingly with such a man and do not purify

c 

yourself and that person by bringing him to justice . In this case , the man who was killed was



a hired workman of mine , and as we were farming at Naxon , that man was working there



for us . Then he got drunk , and got angry with one of our house slaves , and cut his throat .

’ 

So my father bound him hand and foot , threw him into a trench , and sent



a man here to ask the religious interpreter , that which he should do . But in the meantime

d 

he took no account of the man as he lay there bound , and neglected him , since he was



a murderer and it was none of his business , if he were to die . And that is just what happened . 

For he died of hunger and of cold and of his bonds before the messenger came back from



the interpreter . Thus my father and the rest of my relatives are also angry , indeed because for 

the sake of this murderer I am prosecuting my father for murder . For as they say , neither did he



kill him , and not even if he had killed him , since the dead man was indeed a murderer ,

’

I should not give any thought for the sake of such a person ; because it is unholy for a son e

to prosecute his father for murder . Which shows how wrongly they know , O Socrates , as to



what The Divine Law is , in regard to Holiness and un-holiness .



Socrates: But , in the name of God , O Euthyphro , do you really imagine your knowledge about



Divine Laws , and Holiness and un-holiness , has to be in such a way so exactly , so that when 

those facts are just so , in such a manner , as you say , that you do not in turn , fear attempting 

to do an un-holy deed yourself , by prosecuting your father ?



Euthyphro: Then my calling would be of no benefit , O Socrates , and neither would Euthyphro

 

be different from the multitude of men , if I did not know , precisely , about all such things .





Socrates: 5 Accordingly then , it is best for me , O my wonderful Euthyphro , to become

’

your pupil and before the suit with Meletus comes on , to challenge him about these same things



and say , that in times past , I at least , considered it very important to know about divine matters ,



and now , since he accuses me of missing that very mark , by talking in an improvised manner



and by making innovations in matters concerning divination, I have then become your pupil . And

b then , on the one hand , I could say ,“O Meletus , if you agree that Euthyphro is wise in such

 

matters , then also believe that I also hold opinions correctly , and do not bring me to trial ; but if 

on the other hand , you do not agree to that , then bring a suit against him , my teacher , rather



than against me , charging him with corruption of the old , namely , his father and me , which he



does by teaching me and by warning and correcting his father .” And should he not be persuaded



by me and does not release me from the indictment or bring it against you instead of me ,

’’

I could then say the same things in court , which I said , in my challenge to him .



Euthyphro: Yes by Zeus , O Socrates , if he should then undertake to indict me , as I suspect , I



would find in what way he is unsound and he rather than me , would be called to account for that

c ’

in court , long before us . 

 .

Socrates: And I , O dear companion , recognizing these things , wish to become your pupil ;



knowing , that not in any way , on the one hand , does this person Meletus , nor does anyone



else , seem to notice you , but on the other hand , he has seen through me so sharply and



so easily , that he has indicted me for impiety .So now , in the name of Zeus , tell me , what you



just now affirmed that you knew so clearly . What do you say is the nature of Piety and impiety , 

both in relation to murder and to other things ? Or is not Holiness The Same with Itself in Every

d 

Action , and in turn , on the one hand , is not un-holiness the opposite of all Holiness , and on the



other hand , whatsoever shall be unholy to do , will always be , like itself , and possess some one



Ideal characteristic quality . (

Euthyphro: Exactly , without a doubt , O Socrates .



Socrates: 6 Tell me then , what do you say The Holy is , and what is the un-holy ?



Euthyphro: Accordingly then , I say that Holiness is , on the one hand , doing the very thing 

I am doing now in prosecuting the wrongdoer whether for committing murder or for stealing from



temples or by failing to hit the mark in any other such thing , even if he happens to be your father 

or even your mother or anyone whatsoever , and on the other hand , not prosecuting him ,

e 

is un-holy . Since , O Socrates , you see , what a great proof I offer you , a quote from the law



that it has to be in this way , and which I have already said to others , that these matters should be 

done correctly and should come to pass in this way , that we should not let go unpunished , he 

who acts impiously, no matter who he may be . For these same men , believe that The God (Zeus) ’

happens to be “the best and most just” of The Gods , and they agree that this same God put His a

Father (Kronos) “in bonds” , because He “wickedly devoured” his Children , and That One



indeed , in turn “mutilated” His Father (Ouranos) for other such reasons ; but they are angered

’

at me , because I proceed against my father when he has done wrong , and in this manner ,



they are at odds in regards to what they say about The Gods and about me .



Socrates: Accordingly indeed , O Euthyphro , is not this , that for the sake of which ,

’

I have been charged by the indictment , because when anyone tells such stories about The Gods ,



I find it difficult , in some way , to accept them ? And certainly , through which , as it is likely , ’

some will accuse me of missing the mark. So now if you, who knows so much about such things ,

b 

accept these tales , I too must certainly , give way to you , as it seems . For what are we to say , 

who candidly confess that we know nothing about them ? But tell me , in the name of The God



of Friendship , do you really believe that these things happened , in this manner ?



Euthyphro: And even still more wonderful things than these , O Socrates , which the multitude



do not know .((Doric)

Socrates: And accordingly do you believe that there was , in reality , a war between The Gods ,



and indeed mutual ill-will and terrible battles and many other things of the sort , such as are told



both by the poets , and by the good artists and variously represented both in our sacred icons

c

but especially on the robe being filled full of such varied representations which is carried up to



the Acropolis at the great Panathenaea ? Shall we affirm that these things are true , O Euthyphro ?



Euthyphro: Indeed , not only these , O Socrates ; but , as I said just now , if you wish , I will set

’

out in detail for you many other things about The Gods , which I well know that will amaze you ,

’

upon hearing .



Socrates: 7 I should not be surprised . But on the one hand , you can set-out for me those things



at your leisure , some other time . And on the other hand , at present , try to tell more clearly



the very thing I asked you just now . Since , O companion , you did not sufficiently instruct me

d 

before , when I asked what , after all , The Holy was , but you told me , that this , which you

’

now happen to be doing , was holy ; prosecuting your father for murder .



Euthyphro: And what I said is indeed true , O Socrates .



Socrates: Perhaps . But then , O Euthyphro , you say many other things are also Holy ?



Euthyphro: And , so they are .



Socrates: Do you remember then , that this is not what I asked you ; to show me one or two



of the many holy acts , but That Same Aspect , by which all Holy Acts are Holy ;

’

for you said that in some way both , un-holy acts are un-holy , and , Holy Ones Holy ,



by One Idea . Or do you not remember ?



Euthyphro: I do indeed .



Socrates: Accordingly then show me This Ideal Aspect Itself , whatever it is , in order that



I may keep my eye fixed upon That , and Employ It as a Model (Paradigm) , and on



the one hand , that which either you or anyone else does , in so far as it should be of Such a Kind ,



we should affirm that it is Holy , but on the other hand , that which is not of Such a Class , ’

we must not affirm to be Holy .



Euthyphro: Then if you so wish me to explain it to you in that way , I will do so , O Socrates .



Socrates: Then I do so wish it indeed .