The Way to a Man’s Heart

Conversation of the Kabbalist Michael Laitman with

the artist and director Armen Dzhigarchanyan,

Moscow, Russia, August 18, 2006

Michael Laitman, PhD, is a prominent Kabbalist, scientist of bio-cybernetics, professor of ontology and of theory of knowledge, founder and director of the Bnei Baruch Kabbalah Education and Research Institute, and the Ashlag Research Institute (ARI.) He is the author of more than 30 books, which are translated into 9 languages. Michael Laitman is a member of the World Wisdom Council, an elite gathering of experts that devote themselves to solving global problems of the modern world. Annually, thousands of students around the world watch lectures by Michael Laitman, transmitted live through cable channels and on

Armen Dzhigarchanyan, a national artist of the USSR (1985). There are more than 200 roles to the actor’s credit. At the end of 1990 he decided to create a theater with his students from The Belgorod National Institute of Culture (BNIC). This is how Moscow Drama Theater under the direction of Armen Dzhigarchanyan was born.

M. Laitman: I am an old fan of yours. You are a very special person. You have lived a long life and you have great life experiences. I have heard that you also are interested in the philosophy of life. I would like to know your impressions about the direction in which society is currently moving. Human egoism has grown to such extent that one is not only incapable of studying with another person, but he also cannot live with himself. Youth is disappointed, devastated from the beginning, and they do not understand whether it is worth existing in this world altogether. Humanity needs a key idea, a concept, and certain motivation; otherwise they feel inner emptiness, heartlessness. What do you think? Is it possible to change anything in this world or it is a very exhausting, long, and even hopeless process?

A. Dzhigarchanyan: If at this moment we risk saying this out loud for everyone to hear, in the form of some kind of an advice for people, then it is very important for you and me to be honest. And even though the definition of “being honest” is very primitive, it is the most difficult thing. This is because everything that you speak about exists and can develop in the most catastrophic manner, in absolutely uncontrollable forms.

I can talk about this, but it is best if I speak about it in my language, in the language of what I do—language of the arts. People say: “Help one return to one’s own self.” However, art is a great herd-like phenomenon, and we need to attempt (which is extraordinarily difficult to do) to find a way to be closer to individualization of man. In what way is art good? [It is good] because it speaks to familiar, eternal things: love, death, hatred, adoration, children, animals.

I adore the postulate: “God gracious, help children and animals.” It is very important because, primitively speaking, our children are future adults. And the child will grow up according to the values that we instill in him. For this reason, if an opportunity arises we must not miss it, similar to the way that religion holds on to such an opportunity.

M. Laitman: Do you believe that religion has the power to change things?

A. Dzhigarchanyan: Possibly, since religion today is the most powerful force in society. One of the classics used to say that if there is no God then it is necessary to invent one. I think that what they had in mind is that society necessarily needs a locomotive that pulls it forward, a leader whom the entire world would absolutely trust.

We should never disregard this, even if we are thoroughly convinced that such person does not exist. This person simply needs to be invented, created. Otherwise, football players will become our leaders. Please agree with me, this isn’t bad either, but only until a certain moment, until problems that we cannot solve, arise. Then we will run to church, and will cry and laugh. If it isn’t church, then we will run to the theater. Trust me, I am not popularizing theater, but theater is my life—an infinitely long path to the hearts of the audience. The slightest mistake, one wrong step and one stops believing us, and they say that we are misleading.

M. Laitman: Can art become an advocate of standards of proper behavior, relationships between people in society and love for one another?

A. Dzhigarchanyan: Let us, if we can, allow people to choose for themselves. I think that if we refrain from forcing people, pushing them in the “right” direction with a rifle, then they will chose for themselves and they will choose correctly. I love the English manner of laying the lawn first, then waiting for people to walk on it, and only then making a pathway there. This is the most correct method. And do you know why we don’t always turn to it? Because it takes time, and we want it right away; we want “a headache tablet for everyone,” so that everything would be fine in 20 minutes! It is always necessary to know that if a tsunami, an earthquake, a misfortune has occurred that at least one other generation will suffer from it. And regrettably we will not do anything about it. Someone (I am afraid of distorting his name) wrote that Chernobyl will continue to live in us for another 300 years, and there will still be times when we will hear the echo of this tragedy.

M. Laitman: Do you think that human egoism is to blame for everything? And is the popular commandment “love your neighbor as yourself” the only possible solution to this problem?

A. Dzhigarchanyan: All of these words require to be verified: what does “love” mean? Who do we keep in mind when we say “neighbor?” Who am “I” [in this picture]? Which words in this sentence do we begin with a capital letter, and which ones do we begin with a lower-case letter?

I fear mass consciousness, mass ecstasy, just like mass fascism. I believe in the power of a leader. But based on examples of our history we see what this leads to. When power falls into the hands of a skilled and talented leader, he simply uses it for his selfish ends, controlling the society through the help of some concealed instruments. Maybe these people where correct and it was only because of them that we managed to build our future. But still, I think that what we have received at the end is not worth such sacrifices.

With your permission, I will compare it to theater. Someone astutely noticed that theater is a miniature model of our society, which has leaders that determine the movement, and those that realize this movement. Both are necessary. A play affects us only because there is a leader that has directed, “smelled,” realized, “digested,” and felt. Do you remember the pyramids of the circus? Circus artists say that there needs to be a bottom one, who holds this pyramid. If he is not there, the pyramid will collapse.

M. Laitman: Even though today you work at a small theater, its impact on masses is enormous. When a spectator comes to see your play, he receives enormous information, even without realizing the way that it affects him. Do you think it is possible to tell people in this manner of what the purpose of life consists?

A. Dzhigarchanyan: Theater has been my life for an indecently long time.This is why I can boldly tell you a certain truth: people go to theater exclusively out of curiosity. But every person comes with his own problems, without even realizing it himself. Theater has a unique ability to touch this painful point in a person’s heart. Especially if we perform that what you call “receiving an answer.” But this phenomenon is concealed.

For this reason if theater touches this painful point in ones heart, then we have the luck of discovering three to five people out of a thousand curious ones that were touched by what they saw. In this case these were five people, next time [the number] is unknown, because these five will take their impressions further, to their kitchen, to work, etc. I think that both religion and church do the same thing.

M. Laitman: But still, what do you think the purpose of a person’s life consists of?

A. Dzhigarchanyan: What is the purpose of a person’s life? I really like what Lev Tolstoy said: “The purpose of life is to live.” He said: “To live.” And I comment further: “To live with the entire complexity and all the difficulties that one happens to come across…” But this response is too general. And if this problem, this question seriously arises before us, then I will be extremely cruel; we must consider each case individually.

In my opinion, if we set a goal for ourselves to help a specific person, then it is much more efficient, better than the goal to correct the entire society. By knowing the name, the last name, the gender of this person, we will understand what this person needs. I believe that our salvation is in individualization, even though this path is very long. Even though it is natural for a person to become tired half way through and say: “The hell with him…”

M. Laitman: Today, our world is in such a state that we simply do not have the time to think matters over. We walk on the edge of a disaster and we must change ourselves in some way. In your opinion, what can we do today?

A Dzhigarchanyan: Nothing. I think it is a dangerous thing to shepherd a herd. Imagine what will happen if active body-builders come and organize Gulags and gas chambers for us again. It seems to me that society needs a “sanitary rest.” Any good doctor will tell his patient in this condition: “The organism has adapted. Let’s avoid bothering it, let’s not give it injections.” Even though all of us understand that recovery in our case is a very long process, such that sometimes we lack patience.

And again with your permission I will give an example from theater life. We rehearse a scene and it is not working out. All of a sudden everything annoys me and I tell the actor: “Listen, go there, stand this way, turn your back to this, and that is it.” It seems that I have solved the problem, right? No, I have not solved it! I have created one more unsettled person. If you cannot solve the problem, then you should not even undertake it!

M. Laitman: Another question arises: does one have freedom of will? We see that we are not born through our own will and that we each have specific attributes; we receive the education that we ourselves do not choose; we become adults with prejudices, inclinations, habits and values imposed by the society. Where do we go next? All that we do in life, we do it on the basis of what was instilled in us from the beginning, the way we were made. It turns out that it seems that I begin to live, but actually it is not I that lives, but some small person that was pushed forward like a mechanical toy, and he continues to do things mechanically.

A. Dzhigarchanyan: The problem of “gravity flow,” inertia of personal development in Russia is not that relevant, because of the example of Danko. He has torn his heart out with the purpose of lighting the path ahead with this “little one.” This is closer to us. With a personality, mentality like ours, “gravity flow,” and especially calm holiday resort life are out of the question.

Freedom of will is something else. After all, freedom of will is a very selective thing. This is why I speak about leaders as a social locomotive. But to expect that freedom of will all of a sudden miraculously appear in everyone… It simply will not happen! There are biological leaders in whom this passion lives; they have different results of incarnating these properties into life. If individual dodgers desire to become leaders, then they already possess specific skills, that is, the potential for this, beforehand. But if everything is to be treated according to the principal: “Let’s do things anyhow…” then nothing will work out! Even king Lear used to say: “Nothing will come of nothing.”

M. Laitman: I think that this is precisely what dodgers are.

A. Dzhigarchanyan: Not exactly. There are those like Anna Karenina, for example. The fact that she will throw herself under a train does not bother her; there are other things that worry her. People like this can become leaders. But this is only when speaking about private individuals. In general terms, what is “Cinderella” based on? From the beginning we propose to wonderful girls to wait for a prince instead of killing their opponents. Regrettably, princes do come and they take all “Cinderellas” away to some other city to work where they use them for their own interest.

M. Laitman: I will tell you why this happens. I study a very ancient science that originated around 5000 years ago in the ancient Mesopotamia. From ancient times this science tells that the entire evolution of humanity is based on the development of egoism in a human being. The time will come when humanity will reach such a level when on the one hand it will feel like it is very small and closed in, like a small village, and on the other hand it will reach such egoistic development that people will not be able to exist and to live at all. The world will be swamped with drugs, depression, suicide, absolute rejection, and hatred.

“It is precisely then (this science tells us) that I will open up to people and I will explain how to reach real fulfillment.” Because in reality the only thing that interests man is receiving pleasure, or “fulfillment.” We cannot, however, become fulfilled egoistically, because pleasure immediately disappears as soon as you receive something egoistically. And in the result of this emptiness that has appeared once again you must run after something new. This merciless law is basically the area of my research and my work.

A. Dzhigarchanyan: What you are speaking about is very important. Can I ask you a question? Are there ways through which one can enter the heart of a human soul?

M. Laitman: There is. In order to do this one gradually needs to explain to people that they live in this closed egoistic little world and feel only that which is convenient to them, but that which is not convenient to their egoism falls outside the borders of their field of vision. It really is a long way, as we have already said. In history, everything happens gradually, through a long dialectic process, without coercion. And when man begins to understand this, we must gradually pull him towards realization that there exists an enormous area of the Universe, which is not yet examined or perceived by us. And we do not perceive it only because we want to “seize” everything for our own sake, to become fulfilled.

If we rose above our constant egoistic concern about fulfilling ourselves, and began to think about how we can give instead of receiving, then we would begin to feel absolutely different levels of the world, which do not relate to our egoism, and exist outside of us. Then, to us, the world would become transparent, large and wide. Naturally we would change our attitude towards others. But the main thing is that we would see how all objects of nature are interconnected—how we are all interconnected.

Here you say: “In my theater I affect a thousand people. Among them maybe three to five people will leave inspired by something.” We would see the way that we are joined together and connected, like the thread on the reverse side of an embroidered picture of this world. We would find out why we affect the world in this way, and why on occasions we receive a completely unpleasant “response.” That is, we would learn to live correctly.

A. Dzhigarchanyan: Do you exclude endowments of perception? Or do you expect that everyone will understand those things that you are now telling me about? Can we expect that at least 80 percent of humanity will understand this?

M. Laitman: One in a thousand will understand. Expectation is that this is a gradual and cumulative process: one, two, three people for example, will develop gradually, and this information will be passed on to their children and their grandchildren.It is impossible without enlightenment, since this approach—without egoism—needs to be developed in a person in some way. Otherwise people, by constantly trying to fulfill themselves egoistically, will continue to make mistakes.

In our world we only see this on the example of the relationship between a mother and a child. If she loves someone, then through “fulfilling” the other, she receives pleasure, and her pleasure and her joy is because another, a person close to her receives pleasure; there are no limits. If in the same manner we could see the picture of the world, that is, our mutual connection with each other—that you, and I, and he, and everyone else are an inherent part of an organic system—then we would receive this opportunity of infinite pleasure through the fulfilling of one another. In reality this is the way that it is, only we cannot see it by virtue of our egoism.