*****DRAFT*****
The Town of Forestburgh Town Board held their regular monthly meeting on Thursday, December 1, 2016 at the town hall.
Supervisor Hogue called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m.
Roll Call: Present – Daniel S. Hogue, Jr., Supervisor
Katherine Barnhart, Councilwoman
John W. Galligan, Councilman
Susan Parks Landis, Councilwoman
Steve Budofsky, Councilman
Absent – None
Recording
Secretary – Joanne K. Nagoda, Town Clerk
Others
Present – E. Danielle Jose-Decker, Attorney for the Town
PUBLIC COMMENT –
Clerk Nagoda congratulated Councilman Galligan and his family on his daughter Meagan Galligan being appointed Chief Assistant District Attorney for the Sullivan County District Attorney’s office.
REPORTS –
Supervisor Hogue submitted a report on financial activity for the month of November 2016.
Town Clerk, Joanne Nagoda submitted a report of clerk fees and activity for November 2026.
Justices Carroll and Gunther submitted a report of justice court fees and activity for November 2016.
MINUTES – Clerk Nagoda submitted minutes of the November regular monthly meeting for review. MOTION by Councilman Galligan, seconded by Councilwoman Landis to accept the minutes as submitted. Vote: 5 ayes – 0 nays. Motion carried.
GENERAL FUND VOUCHERS - # 271 – 295 in the sum of $14,549.79 as set forth in abstract # 12 were audited for payment. MOTION by Councilman Galligan, seconded by Councilman Budofsky to pay general fund vouchers. Councilwoman Landis abstained on the voucher for Evelyn Parks. Vote: 4 ayes – 1 abstention. Motion carried.
HIGHWAY FUND VOUCHERS - #140-163 in the sum of $16,572.08 as set forth in abstract # 12 were reviewed. MOTION by Councilwoman Barnhart, seconded by Councilman Galligan to accept the highway fund vouchers. Vote: 5 ayes – 0 nays. Motion carried.
NEW BUSINESS
MARSHALL & STERLING –Supervisor Hogue stated that we have Brad Palmiter of Marshall & Sterling Insurance to give us a presentation on MVP Health Insurance. Mr. Palmiter thanked the board for their time and presented an alternative to the NYSHIP health insurance. He explained that MVP is based out of Schenectady but has a very strong presence in the Hudson Valley. In addition to their local network, they have access to the CIGNA national network. Every municipality funds the entire deductible amount – the employees get a debit card that is linked to your account to fund the deductible. Right now your NYSHIP plan is considered a platinum plan, if you go with the MVP silver plan, which is considered a high deductible plan, if everybody used all of the money on their card it’s still less than the NYSHIP plan. The savings are substantial. MVP has not only the insurance and administers the fund. The only place the debit card will actually be used is at the pharmacy – everything else is billed directly. Mr. Palmiter then explained a spread sheet comparing coverage against the NYSHIP program. He recommends the town fund the entire deductible and even in doing that it saves a considerable amount of money. He also pointed out that NYSHIP only has two tiers – single or family. MVP offers single, husband and wife, single parent with children and family. More people fit into the two middle two categories. Right now family with NYSHIP is $1,900 a month and with MVP it’s $1,100 but of course you then have to fund the deductible. If you go with the silver plan it’s a 26% savings which is significant. That is giving your employee’s 100% coverage with only co-pay at the pharmacy. Lately I have had many municipalities go with the silver program – its 100% coverage and the town still saves money. They go with the silver because it’s an easier sell to the employees. All of these plans have to have an out of pocket maximum by law but with the silver 8 plan it’s hard to max out on the out of pocket expenses. Supervisor Hogue asked if everyone gets a benefit card and there would be no co-pay for a doctor’s visit and prescriptions? Mr. Palmiter replied yes, except prescriptions would be $10, $40 or $60. Discussion was held on the increasing rates NYSHIP is going up 12% and the MVP rates are increasing by 7%, Mr. Palmiter will recalculate these figures that he used for the spread sheet. There are no referrals necessary with MVP and must use the network physicians but you also have the CIGNA network as well. Supervisor Hogue asked what about the retirees? Mr. Palmiter stated we need to talk about that – retiree’s that are under 65, this would be the plan. Fore retiree’s over 65, we will have to talk about that. There are other plans for that. Supervisor Hogue stated that with NYSHIP we have to reimburse the retiree’s for the part B and it’s also my understanding that NYSHIP is the only one who has that requirement. One of my municipalities has MVP gold and they had a problem with a few retiree’s moving to Florida and MVP Gold doesn’t go to Florida. We presented another product for about the same amount of money – it covered those in Florida and basically what it is, is a Medicare supplement program. If you went with something like this the retiree’s would be picking up part of the cost on that. Councilwoman Barnhart asked Mr. Palmiter to take the silver 8 plan and explain who pays for what in that plan. He stated starting at the top, the $3,500 and $7,000 the town would pay for that. Then do you see where it says $5,500 for single and $11,000 for family that is the out of pocket maximums. All small plan groups have to have an out of pocket maximum. That is your safety net. The member would never go over $5,500 for single or $11,000 for family. Right out of the gate the $3,500 and the $7,000 is being paid for by the town. The only difference between them is the co-pays on prescriptions. The chances of hitting those out of pocket maximums are very low. The first $3,500 of the $5,500 is being paid for by the town. If you hit that maximum, then you are done – you don’t pay for anything. The insurance covers everything. Mr. Palmiter thanked the board for their time. He will rework the numbers with the increases and get them back to the board.
DAVID BODENSTEIN – MIKE PREIS INSURANCE – Supervisor Hogue explained that Mike Preis Insurance had met with Councilman Budofsky and Councilwoman Barnhart to compare MVP with NYSHIP. Mr. Bodenstein asked if there were any questions from what his girl Jess had presented to what was presented tonight, specifically because you have a January 1 renewal date. If you are entertaining a change out of the NYSHIP plan, you will have to entertain it at tonight’s meeting. Councilman Budofsky asked if Mr. Palmiter’s numbers were correct on 70-75% on the utilization. Jess explained that theirs regularly goes from 28 – 40%. Councilman Budofsky stated that is a large discrepancy. She replied he may have greater numbers because he handles more municipalities than we do. Mr. Bodenstein stated from the way it sounds he does a lot in Orange, Ulster, Rockland Counties. Some of his towns are similar in size and others are significantly larger, so they may be experiencing a higher utilization rate. Councilman Galligan asked exactly what are you talking about. Mr. Bodenstein replied as far as utilization goes? We have seen between 25 – 45% that is our experience with our groups thus far in Sullivan County. I would agree with what he said that IF you hit your max with everybody, what you would experience, from a premium perspective, would be similar to what you are paying with NYSHIP. You wouldn’t experience a savings that year. The HRA concept is that you, either municipality or the employer is putting up some money, doing the funding, the advantage to the employee is they are not experiencing deductibles, co-pays, depending ultimately on how you tailor your plan. If your employees have a good experience, you are going to see savings. If they have a poor experience, you are going to pay out premiums similar to what you are paying now. There really is not a big downside to the employers. You will share in the experience is you don’t experience a high utilization. Councilman Budofsky stated he reached out to Jo-Ann Baker, the bookkeeper in Callicoon, it is five years they have been using you and MVP and they seem very happy with it. Supervisor Hogue stated that the towns of Delaware, Callicoon, Fremont, Cochecton all are using it. He further asked the plans that Mr. Palmiter offered were the silver 3 and silver 8, is that what you are proposing as well? Jess replied yes, that is what we are proposing and my proposal we suggest the town funding just the deductible and the out of pocket max, which is what the rest of our municipalities are doing. They are funding the out of pocket max, the employees lay out absolutely no money. As far as the employee is concerned, compared to NYSHIP that is better. Supervisor Hogue asked if that included prescriptions. Jess replied yes, out of pocket expenses. Supervisor Hogue stated there is no cost to the employee. Mr. Bodenstein replied that is correct. Clerk Nagoda asked what if someone has a surgeon and/or oncologist that is currently under their care and they are not participating providers? They replied that would be a bridge we would have to cross when we got to it. That absolutely could happen. You would have to choose a new doctor. This is why we send out the provider search website right away so you can verify that your doctor participates or so you have time to find a new doctor and get records transferred. Supervisor Hogue asked if this has been an issue with any of the other towns who have this insurance. Mr. Bodenstein replied to his knowledge, this has only happened once with one person in one other town. Supervisor Hogue stated that the contract with highway says equitable insurance to NYSHIP and if the town funds the plan and the out of pocket, this appears to be equitable. Councilman Galligan stated that we haven’t seen anything, you said you sent stuff out and we never saw any of it. He continued by stating that this plan that you are showing us is the same as the other presentation just a different vendor. Mr. Bodenstein replied yes, you have to figure out how you want to structure the plan and who you would like to use as a broker. It is the same company, the same plan just different brokers. Councilwoman Landis asked what is the deadline. Mr. Bodenstein replied you will have to make some sort of decision tonight, you renew on January 1st. The company likes to have everything in place by the 25th of the preceding month, but due to the holidays, they will back it up to December 15. You need to have time to have the new cards issued before the plan takes effect. Councilwoman Landis stated that she too didn’t even know this even being considered and also has not received any of the things you said you sent. Discussion was held with regard to getting the information to the highway guys and the retirees and having a special meeting to present this to the retirees and highway department. Councilman Budofsky stated he has two concerns: one being the other presentation (Marshall & Sterling) showed fourth quarter figures as opposed to the January numbers and the difference in the utilization rate. Supervisor Hogue stated he has much more faith in Mike Preis Insurance than Marshall & Sterling. They are more professional and honest. Councilman Galligan stated that we have to sell this to the highway department and I am against it myself. If you want to look into for next year, that is fine. Councilman Budofsky stated we still have some time to get the information to the highway department. Supervisor Hogue stated that from his discussions with other towns the coverage is comparable and we’re getting between $20,000-$37,000 savings. There is no out of pocket cost to the employees and those that do contribute, their costs would go down because the premium is less. Councilman Galligan stated we should talk to NYSHIP, I’ve had it for years and it’s excellent. If you change now, it will be a disaster in my opinion. Supervisor Hogue stated it all comes down to price. If we are looking at equitable coverage for $37,000 less. I sat on the other side of the table for 24 years and NYSHIP is the Cadillac of a plan and how can the taxpayers afford it. Councilwoman Barnhart stated if we can do it, I’d like to do it. Councilman Budofsky agreed. Mr. Bodenstein offered to get all of the information to everyone first thing tomorrow morning and come back and do a presentation to the highway department. Councilman Galligan reiterated his dislike of the entire change and that he and Councilwoman Landis knew nothing of this or they would have done some research. Councilwoman Barnhart stated that Councilman Galligan and Councilwoman Landis knew nothing about this. The meetings were had by myself and Councilman Budofsky with the representatives of Marshall & Sterling and Mike Preis Agency. Had I known there was this kind of a time frame, I would have given them the information.Supervisor Hogue stated they have been talking about other insurance options for ten years.
MOTION by Councilwoman Barnhart, seconded by Supervisor Hogue to hold a special meeting on Wednesday, December 15, 2016 at 5:30 for the informational presentation of a change in health insurance. Vote: 4 ayes – 1 nay. Motion carried.
YEAR END MEETING – Supervisor Hogue stated that we have to schedule the year end meeting, it is really just to pay bills and clean up anything that might be leftover. Discussion was held on dates and times. MOTION by Councilwoman Barnhart, seconded by Councilwoman Landis to hold the year end meeting on Wednesday, December 28, 2016 at 3:00 p.m. in the town hall. Vote: 5 ayes – 0 nays. Motion carried.
INDOOR RECREATIONAL FACILITY –We all received an email for Attorney Jose requesting guidance on which way to go with this definition. Supervisor Hogue read two proposed definitions one for an indoor shooting range facility or a more generic commercial indoor facility that could house a bowling alley, skateboard park, etc. Or number three is “recreational facility” designed to provide overnight accommodations in permanently constructed buildings that allows recreational uses such as horseback riding, swimming, summer camps for youth etc. Or number four is commercial recreational facility – an indoor or outdoor private run business including playing fields, courts, arenas designed to support recreational activity such as, but not limited to billiards, bowling, dance hall, indoor shooting ranges etc. We also need to decide if there should be space permitted for retail and/or food. All would also require a special use permit. Attorney Jose stated that I know the definition of recreational facility doesn’t really fit, but if you’re going to a bowling alley, you might want to rent shoes or buy a bag. I don’t know if a café is being contemplated – you are not doing this just for a shooting range. It was also brought up to allow something like the proposed “Tent Days” project. Councilwoman Barnhart asked what is the advantage of number four over number two – number two is more general, but I don’t know what our goal is. Attorney Jose replied that is what I’m looking for, I can blend the two if that is the direction you’re going. Supervisor Hogue stated that retail sales should be a part of this, I don’t care if it’s a bowling alley, archery shop or gun shop, you might want to sell bullets. Something else that should be included in this too is a residency on premises for owners or hired security. If “Tent Days” goes through, they are going to need overnight staff, so I think having a place for residency, whether its seasonal or year round. Councilman Budofsky stated he is in favor of blending the two.
UNFINISHED BUSINESS
EXTERMINATOR – Supervisor Hogue introduced Bryce Flynn of Pro-Tect Exterminators who was the only quote received. Mr. Flynn thanked the board and asked if there were any questions on his bid and he submitted a certificate of insurance and a copy of the labels of the chemicals he will be using to treat the locations. Discussion was held on the locations to be treated. Mr. Flynn stated that when treating the log cabin he would not only treat the exterior but the interior as well. Mr. Flynn explained that he and his wife live right up the road and own two other businesses in Monticello. They are local and answers his phone day and night. Should we encounter a problem he has no problem stopping by on a weekend or evening. Councilwoman Barnhart asked how toxic are the chemicals that would be used. Mr. Flynn stated especially on the playground areas and where the kids are, we are very conscious about that, the product that we use dries in about four hours and after that is perfectly safe. You tell me what time the kids are gone and I will come and treat the playground after they are gone. I don’t and won’t treat the parts that the kids actually touch I treat up higher where insects are more likely to build nests. Councilman Galligan asked if a contract is required to which Mr. Flynn replied that he doesn’t require a contract. MOTION by Supervisor Hogue, seconded by Councilman Budofsky to hire Pro-Tect Exterminators at the quoted price for 2017. Vote: 5 ayes – 0 nays. Motion carried.