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Report of the EGOLF TC2 (fire resistance) meeting held on 24th March 2015 at CSI S.p.A., VialeLombardia 20, 20021 Bollate (MI), Italy
Welcome and introductionsRaoul Gatti, CEO of CSI S.p.A. welcomed EGOLF to Bollate. The TC2 Chairman, Lars Boström, thanked him and his colleagues at CSI for hosting the Spring meetings and for the planned visitand dinner in Bergamo.
1 / To approve the draft agenda, N750rev2
The agenda was approved, subject to addition of following item under any other business:
- Powerpoint presentation by MetehanÇaliş (TSE, Turkey) on lintel fire resistance test problem
2 / To approve the report of the previous meeting held on 16th October 2015, N750rev2
The report of the last meeting was approved.
3 / To consider any matters arising not dealt with elsewhere on agenda
The SG reminded everyone that all templates (EGRs, EGPs etc.) can be downloaded from the "Templates" area of the Publications folder on the EGOLF website. These now include a check box to indicate whether or not the document should be addressed to CEN TC 127. All other matters arising are dealt with elsewhere on the agenda.
4 / Helpdesk reports 2013 (N712rev2) and 2014 (N746)
These reports are for information only. They are regularly updated on the EGOLF helpdesk forum.
5 / Formal EGOLF recommendations and position papers published since October 2014
- EGR 85verification wood studs – loadbearing samples
Action: Executive
In the meantime, the Chairman will respond to an editorial request from DBI in respect of moisture content, after which the SG will upload revised EGR 85 to the publications folder of the EGOLF website.
Actions: L Boström/SG
- EGR 87 – EN 1634-1:2014 location unexposed face thermocouples on the frame
6 / TC2 Activities
6.1 Harmonisation courses
The EGOLF course catalogue (Pl N712) was noted.
EN 1366-1 and -8
Christian B. Anderson (DBI) reported on this course which had been held at DBI on 3rd and 4th March. The feedback was very good from all 18 participants and already six members had expressed interest in attending the course at a future date. Three helpdesk items had also been generated on the forum for the attention of TC2 in the Autumn. The SG will circulate a message to members to find out if there is a need for the course to be repeated before the end of the year.
Actions: SG
EN 1366-1 and -2 illustrated through EN 1364-1
Niall Rowan will shortly provide an announcement and invitation for this course which is to be held in Warrington on 20 and 21 May 2015.
Action: N Rowan/SG
EN 13381-4 and -8 and assessment methods plus prEN 13381-3
This series, which will take place from 25-29 May at ITB Warsaw, is already fully booked, with five participants on the waiting list. It is therefore planned to repeat the course in the Autumn.
Action: M Łukomski
EN 1366-3, 15882-3 and 1366-4
The date of the penetration and linear seals course (EN 1366-3, 15882-3 and 1366-4) at SP is to be changed. L Boström will provide new dates with announcement and invitation.
Action: LBoström/SG
EN 1366-2
At the request of members, SP will add part 12 to the fire dampers course material which was recently endorsed by Executive and will take place in the Autumn.
Action: S van der Wetering
EN 1365-1 and -2
During the meeting, a great deal of interest was expressed in thiscourse. Marek Łukomski(ITB) and Lars Boström(SP) agreed to draft a proposal by mid-May for attention of Executive.
Action: M Łukomski/L Boström
EN 1364-3 and -4
Likewise, members expressed plenty of interest. Gert van den Berg (Efectis NL) offered to develop the course material. He will first prepare a costed proposal by mid-May for attention of Executive.
Action: G van den Berg
6.2 Round robins
Presentation of draft report RR to EN 1363-1:2012 and EN 1365-3:1999
Fabien Dumont gave a detailed presentation of thedraft results of this round robin, which had involved a great deal of work by the organisers. The results will also be captured in a formal report for sign off by TC2 in the Autumn. In the meantime; the presentationwill be circulated to participating labs. and then made available on the Round Robin folder of the EGOLF website. Members are reminded that this document is confidential.
Action: SG/F Dumont
Although the RR haddemonstrated good repeatability, several variations had been identified and
it is expected that a number of recommendations will come out of the final report. One example cited was interpretation of the definition of loadbearing capacity, since there is a conflict between the definition in the test standard, which refers to the "time at which the first of both criteria “deflection” OR “rate of deflection” is met" and the classification standard EN 13501-2:2009 which refers to the "time at which both “deflection” AND “rate of deflection” criteria are met". It was also noted that the current standards do not provide any method to compute the rate of deflection and so labs. are free to use their own numerical differentiation method.
Reference was also made to compliance with EGOLF's minimum membership requirements, since a number of labs. are accredited to this test method but did not participate in the RR. Others, which had originally intended to participate, subsequently withdrew because they were not able to perform the test.
Public summary report RR classification and EXAP
Since this was a qualitative as opposed to a quantitative RR, the risk of misunderstanding involved in trying to produce a public summary report is considered to outweigh the benefits of such a document. A summary report will therefore not be published. However, a number of recommendations and valuable information had come out of this exercise and the subsequent workshop on EXAP for glazed constructions and this is all captured in document N752.
RR Guidelines: Ownership of results (Chapter 5)
Instructions concerning ownership of RR results is captured below. Rupert Ehrlenspiel, Chair TC1, pointed out that a sentence is needed with regard to presentation of individual results to national accreditation bodies. This has been added to Chapter 5 (Ownership of results)of the Guidelines on the Publications folder on the EGOLF website.
About the individual test results:
- Each laboratory which participates in an EGOLF RR is the owner of its own test results and may thus use them as desired.
- Except for publication in the EGOLF confidential and public summary reports, any other use of individual test results requires the permission of individual laboratories which participate in an EGOLF RR; they alone have the right to decide how their own tests results can be used.
- The full report and its content shall remain confidential amongst EGOLF members. This shall be stated on the front page of the report. The foreword of the report shall contain the following sentence:
- The public summary report and its content may be used as desired.
Feedback from EGOLF Workshop: EXAP for glazed constructions, N752
Stefan van der Wetering made a brief presentation of the summary report and actions arising which are captured in document N752. Recommendations and clarifications from this report which are for the attention of CEN will be included in the TC2 Chairman's liaison report in time for CEN TC 127 meeting on 12 May.
Action: L Boström
On the subject of classification reports for different elements, it was agreed that there should be one type of classification report for each type of element. According to the CPR, the product family is defined by the manufacturer. Guidance is contained in EN 15725 (the general standard for EXAPs). If, therefore, we want technically based rules, we cannot call it "product family".
In respect of 7.2 (exchange of timber wood species), Rupert Ehrlenspiel informed members that TUM had carried out a study with values of charring rates. The study had been repeated and they now have about 1000 values for species with their Latin names; this data could be used to define a rule e.g. take worst and best of charring rates found worldwide. Many hours would be needed to evaluate the results. The problem in the standard is that moisture content is equated with the charring rate and so, if EGOLF defines a rule, this would need to be based on the charring rate and disregard the moisture content.
More labs. would have liked to attend the workshop and so a second one may be organized before the end of the year, in order to go into more detail and using N752 report as the basis for discussions. Lars will prepare an invitation for circulation to members.
Actions: L Boström/SG
Feedback from EGOLF Workshop: Loadbearing walls
Since Nathalie Briand was not present, C Tessier requested that this item be taken forward to the Autumn meeting.
Action: N Briand/SG
7 / To note activities in CEN/TC 127 on fire resistance, N757 & N758rev1
The CEN TC 127 work programme and WG1 update were noted.
After the EGOLF meeting in October, the Chairman had referred four helpdesk items which were in need of clarification from CEN TC 127 but no replies had, as yet, been received from the respective WG convenors. The Chairman will raise this issue in his liaison report next month and ask for information from CEN about their procedure for dealing with EGRs and EGPs. It was also suggested that, in future, EGOLF should provide solutions to all items raised for attention of CEN, since this at least would facilitate discussion. Lars will also ask for confirmation that recommendations and position papers are taken into consideration during revisions to the standards.
Action: Lars Boström
8 / Presentation: EXAP 15254-5 extrapolation of height above 4m in partition of metal sandwich panels, N749
Eric Wellens presented this report. He is a member of CEN TC127 WG1 TG4, which is in charge of the revision of EN 15254-5(extended application of metal sandwich panels). This technical committee read the EGOLF paper TC2 N672b and decided to investigate in more detail the span length extension which is based on Δc and Δf calculations. For this purpose, they received new data from SP Laboratory, Paroc Company and EAPP (European Association for Panels and Profiles). The data was added to TC2 N672b. Work continues on this new version of the CEN WG report (N749) in which 36 test results have been evaluated. The general view is that Δc and Δfare good rules but they need to adjust the value of these tests. The consensus is currently eight meters and the idea is to verify the behaviour of the panel tested (3m and 6m).
9 / Helpdesk Items
2012-19, N760
EN 15650 example of Certificate – Constancy of Performance / Subject to deletion of sentence "The validity shall be confirmed by … once a year", this proposal shall be forwarded to CEN TC 127/WG2/TG4
Action: G Blume
2013-11,N714rev2
Draft EGR
Evaluation of primers / Members have one week for comment prior to publication of EGR on the EGOLF website.
Action TC2/SG
2014-02
EN 1366 smoke damper in hot mode / This action will be taken forward again to Autumn meeting.
Action: G Blume
2014-05 N761
overlapped curtains / The Chairman did not receive a reply from CEN TC 127 WG3. ThisTC2 will discuss this again in the Autumn and try to solve the problem for attention of CEN.
Action: TC2
2014-09, N759
Draft EGR EN 1364-3:2014 gaskets / Members have one week for comment prior to publication of EGR on the EGOLF website.
Action: TC2/SG
2014-10, N736rev1
Draft EGR EN 1364-3:2014 increase in width / The Chairman will include this draft EGR in his liaison report to CEN TC 127.
Action: L Boström
2014-12, N745
ETAG 018-2 assessing different primers and topcoats with same type intumescent, N744 / The SG sent this draft EGR to Gunter Hoppe at DIBT, who is convenor of the group developing ETAG 018-2 standard. He replied that EOTA is using ETAG 018-2 and converting this into the new EAD format and that the group would look at the EGOLF paper when reviewingthe new EAD in written consultation with the members of the working group.
N747
Draft EGR EN 13501-2 content of DIAP statements / The Chairman will check this draft EGR and then members will have one week to comment prior to publication on the EGOLF website. (Post meeting note: Further to check by the Chairman and colleagues at SP, their interpretation is such that it is the sum of DIAP and EXAP that shall be written in the classification report. A revised EGR will be drafted for comment by TC2 members and to ensure there is a common view, prior to publicationon the EGOLF website).
Action: L Boström/TC2/SG
2015-01, N753
EN 1366-10how to assess maintenance of opening/reduction cross-section / Gary Blume will decide if a workshop or, alternatively, a meeting of the smoke damper group is required to deal with this and other issues related to EN 1366-10. If it is decided to hold a workshop, Gary will prepare a proposal.
Action: G Blume
2015-02, N754
EN 13381-4 and EN 1363-2hydrocarboncurve / Although it is possible to perform tests and issue test reports, it is currently not possible to issue classification reports for tests performed for a hydrocarbon curve; there is only a CUAP procedure. This is a matter for industry to raise with the Commission and so the item is closed.
Action: SG to add to helpdesk report
2015-03, N755
problemswith EN 1366-10 / Gary Blume agreed to add this to list of topics for attention of expert group on smoke dampers
Action: G Blume
2015-04, N756
EN 1363-1 conditioning of test specimen / This is a very big question. It may be necessary to have a special working group to look at certain materials. The Chairman offered to circulate this document to the embryo ISO group and EGOLF members are welcome to join.
Action: L Boström
10 / Any other business
Three items were raised:
i) ÉMI in Hungary offered to organize a workshop to discuss façade testing problems and solutions for EOTA. IstvánMóder will draft a proposal by mid-May for the attention of Executive.
Action: I Moder
ii) A presentation was given by MetehanÇalişon the subject of lintel fire resistance tests problems. This is a big problem which cannot be resolved by EGOLF because it is not in the product standard.
iii) A presentation by Eric Wellens (Université de Liège) on loadbearing capacity criteria in fire resistance testing. There is a conflict between the test standard and the classification standard and it is clear that the test standard has to be changed. The advice of TC2 Chairman is to keep things simple; it does not matter if it is deflection or rate of deflection. This presentation has been made to CEN TC 127 WG1. Their next meeting is on 13thMay .
11 / Date and venue of next meetings:
- 15th October 2015 at TSE, Istanbul
- 26th April 2015 at IBS, Linz
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List of Delegates
Chairman Lars Boström
Country / Organisation / Name / SAustria / IBS / Marcus Eichhorn-Gruber
MA 39
Belarus / RIFS / AnatloiLushchyk
VeronikaKashankova
Belgium / ISSEP
LIEGE / Eric Wellens
Fabien Dumont
wfrgent / Edwin van Wesemael
Bulgaria / RIFS
Czech Republic / PAVUS / Jaroslav Dufek
Denmark / DBI / Christian B. Andersen
Estonia / TUV Estonia / Fred Haas
Finland / VTT / Markus Taipale
France / CERIB / Christophe Tessier
CSTB
Efectis France / Pascal Coget
Roman Chiva
LNE
Germany / BAM / Sacha Hothan
Frank Klemmstein
Dibt
DMT / Simon Ludaescher
MPA Uni. Stuttgart
MFPA LEIP / Michael Juknat
MPA Dresden GmbH / Thomas Beutner
MPA HANN / Bernd Restorff
MPA B’WEIG / Gary Blume
MPA NRW
P HOCH
TUM / RupertEhrlenspiel
Hungary / EMI / IstváanMóder
ImreJuhász
Israel / SII / Apologies
Italy / CSI
I GIORD / Stefano Vasini
LAPI / David Borsini
RINA / Enrico Cabella
Latvia / MeKA
Lithuania / FRC LITH / Donatas Lipinskas
Mindaugas Grigonis
Žydrūnas Kuodis
Netherlands / Efectis NL / Gert van den Berg
BDA
Peutz / Jacques Mertens
Norway / SP Fire Research AS / HeliVälimäki
Poland / CTO / Sebastian Ukleja
ITB / Marek Łukomski
Russia / VNIIPO / Irek Khasanov
Elena Mikhaylova
Aleksandr Strekalev
Anatoly Makarevich
Sergei Seregin
Mikhail Dubinin
Slovakia / FIRES / ŠtefanRástocký
DávidŠubert
Slovenia / ZAG / NatašaKnez
Spain
AITEX
APPLUS-LGAI / Jordi Mirabent
GAIKER
LEITAT
TECNALIA
Sweden / SP Fire Technology / Lars Boström
Stefan van de Wetering
Switzerland / EMPA / Thomas Nussbaumer
Swissi Process Safety
Turkey / Efectis ERA Avrasya / Ali Bayraktar
TSE / MetehanÇaliş
Ali Katirci
UAE / TBWIC
UK / BRE
BM Trada / Philip Howard
CFR / Stuart Plummer
Exova Warrington / Niall Rowan
FM Approvals
USA / FM Approvals
Secretary General / Christine Roszykiewicz
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