Premeditated Parenting

Discipline Discussion Questions

Proverbs 13:24 He who spares the rod hates his son, but he who loves him is careful to discipline him.

Proverbs 22:15 Folly is bound up in the heart of a child, but the rod of discipline will drive it far from him.

Proverbs 23:13-14 Do not withhold discipline from a child; if you punish him with the rod, he will not die. 14Punish him with the rod and save his soul from death.

Proverbs 29:15 The rod of correction imparts wisdom, but a child left to himself disgraces his mother.

1. Make a list of some of the benefits of using “the rod” from the above verses:

2. Do you think using the rod always results in these benefits? Why or why not?

3. Can these same benefits also be achieved by using other disciplinary techniques?

4. After discussing the biblical case for spanking with your parents they get on the web and find an article written by By William Sears, M.D., and Martha Sears, R.N. from their book The Complete Book of Christian Parenting and Child Care. An excerpt follows:

At first reading, it would seem that the Bible takes a clear stand in favor of spanking as an important mode of correction. While these passages seem to support spanking, this is not the only way to interpret them.
While it is clear that the rod does appear to be an object to strike with, the term rod is also used in the Bible in connection with the shepherd's staff: “Your rod and your staff, they comfort me” (Ps. 23:4). The shepherd's staff was used to guide the wandering sheep along the right path. The rod was used to beat off predators-—not to hit sheep who strayed.
The original Hebrew word shebet means “a stick” for punishing, writing, fighting ruling, walking. Proverbs 13:24 would be translated: “He who spares his ruling [authority] hates his son, but he who loves him disciplines him promptly.” In other Old Testament books there are uses of the word shebet that are obviously symbolic.

In the New Testament, Christ preached gentleness, love and understanding, as did Paul: “Shall I come to you with a rod, or in love and a spirit of gentleness?” (1 Cor. 4:21). In the New Testament, Christ did not overturn the laws of the Old Testament but simply fulfilled them to a higher level of spirituality and understanding: He stressed discipline and direction from within rather than direction by force from without. Given the context of the total Bible, we feel God makes it clear that you don't have to spank to be a godly parent.

How would you respond to this article? Could spanking be figurative?

5. They found another article called Sparing the Rod, an interview of Susan Lawrence, who campaigned to stop the production of a spanking instrument. An excerpt is below. Please discuss each question and answer. Is she right? What good points does she have? Where does she err in her biblical interpretation and judgment?

You've said you believe that spanking children is unchristian. Why?
Yes, I do. It’s against the Golden Rule, that’s the number one rule that Jesus gave us for human relationships. You’re supposed to treat other people the way you want to be treated yourself. And of course we don’t want to be hit in any way, so we shouldn’t hit other people. And of course, children are people. It’s obvious that we shouldn’t do that to children.

Is spanking a violation of the Golden Rule? Why or why not?

Why do you think [spare the rod and spoil the child] is referenced as if it’s a biblical quote?
There are about five verses in Proverbs that do speak of beating your son with a rod, and also in Proverbs they speak of beating fools on the back, and that kind of thing. There’s a lot of punishment in the Old Testament. If you read the whole thing, there are floggings and stonings and all kinds of harsh punishments.

Why would we believe in spanking and not in stoning? Are we just picking and choosing what we want to follow?

Is spanking just an Old Testament thing?

Are there any Proverbs that should not be followed today?

Let’s talk about Proverbs 23:13: “Do not withhold discipline from a child; if you beat him with a rod he will not die. Beat him with a rod and you will save him from the grave.” How do you interpret that verse?
It’s a lie, because children who are beaten with a rod sometimes do die. Between one and two thousand children die every year in this country from corporal punishment. One hundred forty-two thousand are seriously injured from corporal punishment every year in America, according to the Dept. of Health and Human Services and the New England Journal of Medicine. So it can’t be taken literally.

Also, Proverbs is ascribed to King Solomon. It’s right in the Bible, right in the Book of Kings in the Old Testament, that Solomon displeased God. In the New Testament, Jesus says in chapter 12 of Matthew, that Jesus is greater than Solomon. And I think a lot of fundamentalists just gloss right over that. And also in Matthew, in the transfiguration, God says, “This is my son, with whom I am well pleased. Listen to him.” God never says listen to Solomon.

Do you think over a thousand children die each year in this country from spankings? Is the Bible lying?

Is it true that we should not listen to Solomon?

6. You also have some friends that think that spanking is abusive. Do you think spanking your children will increase the chance that they will be violent and hit other children? Why or why not?

7. Do you think spanking your children will make them despise you and rebel against you even more strongly?

8. Another friend says that spanking can never be truly effective, because it only produces outward change, not inward. How would you respond to this?

9. Author Roy Lessin wrote a book in 1979 called Spanking: Why, When, How. Beth Fenimore’s parents were friends and neighbors of the Lessins, and attended their church. The following is an excerpt of a letter she wrote as an adult describing the damage she feels was done to her as a result of her parents following Roy Lessin’s spanking methods.

Both Char, [Roy’s wife,] during my call with her, and you, in your first book, talk about spankings having a higher purpose in saving the soul. You reference Proverbs 20:30: "Blows that wound cleanse away evil; strokes make clean the innermost parts." Those "blows" left horrible marks on my body that made sitting difficult and bathing with soap sting horribly, and they terrified my spirit.

Feeling terrified isn't the only outcome I live with. Ten years ago a gastroenterologist diagnosed me with IBS, a condition I've had since I was around three years old. Because of the fierce anxiety I felt because of the Roy Lessin spankings, I had terrible chronic stomachaches and diarrhea while I was growing up and as an adult. Five years ago my psychiatrist diagnosed me with post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD), and I began to work through my deeply rooted fears of my parents and the Roy Lessin spankings. Later a physician associate (PA) diagnosed me with asthma and severe allergies from a poor immune system, a result of my chronic anxiety. The same PA told me that I'm at high risk for colon cancer because of the years of IBS as a result of my anxiety. Roy, these problems are all due to my parents implementing your teachings using Roy Lessin spankings to correct a multitude of childhood blunders and attitudes. I can't imagine why a parent would want these outcomes for their child. I may have looked happy and acted lovingly towards my parents, but I was emotionally and physically sick inside! Your teachings gave me no option but to live a horrible lie of looking happy when I was miserable.

What are your thoughts? Do spankings do more harm than good?

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