Smedley Hydro
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[Town/city]
[County Postcode]
Mr George Tsigarides
By e-mail to:
15 July 2016 / Trafalgar Road
Birkdale, Southport
Merseyside, PR8 2HH
T: 0300 123 1837
Dear Mr Tsigarides
Thank you for your e-mails of 15 June 2016 requesting internal reviews of our responses to your questions relating to birth certificates. You previously asked for such an internal review in emails dated 17 May and 24 May. In response to those emails, the Home Office Information Rights Team wrote to you on 14 June advising that they are unable to conduct an internal review under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA).
That letter explains your questions do not meet the requirements of the FOIA because a request for information under the FOIA must describe the information requested whereas you have asked for clarification of processes. That letter further explains your requests should be treated as general correspondence and that your emails of 17 and 24 May would be forwarded for attention. They have been passed to this Office, as have your emails of 15 June.
It is not within the remit of the General Register Office (GRO) to conduct an internal review under the FOIA (this is a matter for the Information Rights Team). However, under our ‘Putting Things Right’ procedure for customers who are not satisfied with the correspondence they have received,your request for an internal review of our responses has been treated as a 1st Stage Complaint.
Please see the further advice that can be found online at -
Under the 1st Stageprocedures, I have completed a review of your enquiries and the responses that you were provided with. I have examined previous correspondence and consulted with the business units that provided the original responses. I have also considered whether the correct procedures were followed. I confirm that I was not involved in the initial handling of your requests.
Before coming to my conclusions I think it would be helpful if I explain that GRO oversees the civil registration system in England and Wales and maintains the national record for all births, stillbirths, adoptions, civil partnerships, marriages and deaths in England and Wales from 1 July 1837.The birth registration process is governed by the Births and Deaths Registration Act 1953, which contains the provisions for the issue of birth certificates. A birth certificate is evidence that a birth occurred and has been recorded. The responses that have been given about birth certificates need to be seen in that context.
My conclusion is that the initial responses to your requests are correct. My findings on the subjects you have raised (as listed) are given below.
1) Foreign Situs Trust Account
2) Is a Birth Certificate a 'Title'
3) How to File a Notice of Lien against a Birth Certificate (which is on 'Bonded Paper')
4) Cestui-Que Trust Account
5) How to obtain a 'Certified' copy of a Birth Certificate
Having read in full the questions and responses given in each of the above cases I am satisfied that the answers adequately and accurately address each of the questions. I am satisfied that there is no additional information you should have been supplied. I am therefore satisfied your complaint about the handling of your requests is not upheld.
In your emails of 17 and 24 May you ask additional questions. I have answered where I have determined thata response has not already been provided in previous replies. Please see Annex below.
Lastly, in your emails of 15 June you reference the Attorney General’s Office (AGO). You would need to raise your enquiry direct with that Office, as we cannot answer for them.
As stated earlier, your request has been treated as a 1st Stage Complaint in line with our complaints procedure. If you are not satisfied with this response, please write to or email (for the attention ofHead of first point of contact):
Head of first point of contact
2nd Stage Complaints
Room E201
General Register Office
HM Passport Office
Trafalgar Road
Southport
PR8 2HH
E:
If after writing to the Head of first point of contact you are still dissatisfied, you may ask your member of Parliament (MP) to raise the matter with the Registrar General or the Home Office minister responsible for the GRO.
If you are still not satisfied, you can ask your MP to request an investigation by the parliamentary commissioner for administration (the Ombudsman).
The Ombudsman’s role is to investigate complaints by members of the public about the way government departments and their executive agencies have treated them. You can only request an investigation through your MP.
Yours sincerely
Customer services manager
Room D116
General Register Office
HM Passport Office
E:
ANNEX:
Response to additional questions raised in emails of 17 and 24 May.
1) Foreign Situs Trust Account
We cannot confirm whether this is something that the FCO (Foreign and Commonwealth Office) will be able to advise you on. We have no knowledge of this subject and it is not something on which we can advise further.
We cannot say whether this is a matter for the ICO (Information Commissioner’s Office). I would suggest you refer to their website for further advice in the first instance. Their details can be found here -
2) Is a Birth Certificate a 'Title'
As mentioned, a birth certificate is evidence that a birth occurred and has been recorded. The birth record will include the name entered for the child and that will be reflected on the birth certificate. There is no “title” attached to the name or certificate.
See my previous comment regarding the ICO.
3) How to File a Notice of Lien against a Birth Certificate (which is on 'Bonded Paper')
You have raised the following comments:
I. If, as you state that there is no difference between a 'copy' a 'true copy' and a 'certified
copy' - please confirm what action, if any, has GRO taken in order to eradicate this confusion.
The Births and Deaths Registration Act 1953 (the Act) refers to the issue of certified copies of entries. We are not in a position to ensure that this term is applied to the exclusion of all others, and it might not be appropriate to do so (for example, where other organisations or individuals use other descriptions).
II. Confirm from the GRO records the actual classification and definition of a 'copy', a 'true copy' and a 'certified copy' of a Birth Certificate - especially the full Statute definition from your records.
In terms of certificates issued by GRO, section 30(2) of the Act states:
“Any person shall be entitled to ….and to have a certified copy of any entry in the said certified copies, on payment to the Registrar General …of the following fees…”. The same term “certified copy” is applied at section 31 and 32 of the Act, in respect of certificates issued by superintendent registrars and registrars. The term “certified copy” is not defined by the Act.
III. If, as you state that Birth Certificates are not proof of identity, please confirm what action, if any, have you taken in order for all businesses and all people in the United Kingdom to be informed not to ever use Birth Certificates as proof of identity - as clearly they are proof or identity, or they are not proof of identity - and there cannot be any middle ground.
From 1992 certificates have been issued with a statement (printed in bold at the foot of the certificate) to warn that a certificate is not evidence of identity. This reads: “WARNING: A certificate is not evidence of identity”. The warning note will therefore be apparent to any government department or organisation to whom a certificate is produced.
IV. If, as you state that Birth Certificates are not proof of identity, please confirm what action, if any, have you taken in order for all businesses and all people in the United Kingdom to be informed not to ever use Birth Certificates as part of their verification processes - as clearly they are proof or identity, or they are not proof of identity - and there cannot be any middle ground.
Banks, Insurance Companies, the Post Office and Government Departments were made aware of the warning note being added to certificates, and will be aware of it from certificates provided to them. It is a matter for individual government departments and other organisations to determine what documents are acceptable to them as part of their verification processes.
V. Please confirm, how, if Birth Certificates are NOT proof of identity, that your records state that Birth Certificates can be used to commit fraud - is this not misleading information and likely to cause confusion.
Although the certificates contain the warning note, it is possible certificates might be used in attempts to commit fraud. If this occurs, it is a matter for the police or other appropriate law enforcement agency.
VI: Please confirm, how, if Birth Certificates are NOT proof of identity, that your records state that Birth Certificates can be used to commit fraud, and that the general public are advised to contact the Police - is this not misleading information and likely to cause confusion.
If the general public are aware that certificates are being used in attempts to commit fraud, I can confirm that they would be advised to contact the police or other appropriate law enforcement agency.
VII. Please confirm that the GRO holds no records of any Birth Certificate Bonds.
As mentioned previously, a birth certificate is evidence that a birth occurred and has been recorded. There is no "bond" attached to the certificate or the birth record.
4) Cestui-Que Trust Account
GRO has no knowledge of a “cestui-que trust account” and we have no knowledge of who does.
5) How to obtain a 'Certified' copy of a Birth Certificate
Our earlier responses have explained how certificates can be obtained form GRO and that they are certified to be a true copy of an original entry. My reference above to the sections of the Act that provide for the issue of certificates helps to explain the situation.
General Register Office: part of Her Majesty’s Passport Office.
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