NONDESTRUCTIVE TESTING
OCTOBER 2010
UNCONFIRMED MINUTES
OCTOBER 19-21, 2010
OMNI WILLIAM PENN HOTEL
PITTSBURGH, PENNSYLVANIA, USA
These minutes are not final until confirmed by the Task Group in writing or by vote at a subsequent meeting. Information herein does not constitute a communication or recommendation from the Task Group and shall not be considered as such by any agency.
Tuesday, October 19, 2010 to Thursday, October 21, 2010
1.0 OPENING COMMENTS
1.1 Call to Order / Quorum Check
The Nondestructive Testing (NDT) Task Group was called to order at 8:02 a.m., 19-Oct-10.
It was verified that only SUBSCRIBER MEMBERS were in attendance during the closed portion of the meeting.
A quorum was established with the following representatives in attendance:
Subscriber Members/Participants Present (* Indicates Voting Member)
NAME / COMPANY NAME* / Chuck / Alvarez / Goodrich Corporation
* / Stephen / Bauer / Northrop Grumman Corporation
* / Mitch / Birzer / General Dynamics Corp.
* / Juergen / Burchards / MTU Aero Engines
* / Michael / Clark / Sikorsky Aircraft Corp.
* / Richard / Costantino / Goodrich Corporation
* / Michael / Daehling / Cessna Aircraft Company
Patrick / Desrosiers / Bombardier Inc.
* / Timothy / Doane / 309th Maintenance Wing – Hill AFB
* / Chris / Dootson / BAE Systems
Dieter / Frentzen / Goodrich Corporation
* / Greg / Hall / Cessna Aircraft Company
* / Sylvain / Heon / Bombardier Inc.
* / Robert / Hogan / Honeywell Aerospace
* / Edward / Hohman / Bell Helicopter Textron Inc.
* / Scott / Iby / Hamilton Sundstrand
* / Ron / Levi / Lockheed Martin Corporation
Michael / Lingbloom / 309th Maintenance Wing - Hill AFB
Luigi / Merletti / AgustaWestland
Roger / Mezenen / 309th Maintenance Wing - Hill AFB
* / Dale / Norwood / Parker Aerospace
* / Gary / O’Neil / Parker Aerospace
* / Robert / Rainone / Goodrich Corporation
* / Robert / Reynolds / The Boeing Company
* / Carl / Roche / Textron Systems
* / David / Royce / Pratt & Whitney / Secretary
Daniel / Ryan / United Space Alliance
* / Bobby / Scott / Bombardier Inc.
* / Michael / Shiplett / Triumph Group, Inc.
Uri / Sol / Israel Aerospace Industries
* / Andy / Statham / Rolls-Royce plc / Acting Chairperson
Marsha / Stermer / Department of Defense
Terho / Sulkupuro / Volvo Aero Corporation
* / Scott / Sullivan / Honeywell Aerospace
* / Dominique / Tomasso / SAFRAN Group
* / Peter / Torelli / The Boeing Company
* / Louis / Truckley / The Boeing Company
* / David / Vaughn / Spirit AeroSystems
Tony / Warren / Airbus SAS UK
Steve / Wells / Goodrich Corporation
Peter / Wong / Goodrich Corporation
Ron / DeJesus / Goodrich Corporation
Other Members/Participants Present (* Indicates Voting Member)
NAME / COMPANY NAMEJohn / Abrahams / RTI International Metals, Inc.
Michael / Ashton / Hexcel Kent
* / Andy / Bakewell / E. M. Inspection Co Ltd.
David / Beard / PCC Airfoils LLC
* / Mario Franco / Bianchi / Bytest S.r.l.
* / N. David / Campbell / West Penn Testing Group
Yongho / Cho / Avibank Mfg., Inc.
Massimo / Colombo / AVIO S.p.A.
Larry / Culbertson / Stork Materials Testing & Inspection
* / Robert / Custer / AAA Plating & Inspection, Inc.
Sharon / Davis / Northeast Testing & Mfg, LLC
Jim / DeChellis / West Penn Testing Group
Samson / Mekuria / PFW Aerospace AG
Fabienne / DuFour / Sherwin Babb Co.
John / Edwards / Edwards Services
* / Paul / Evans / James Fisher IMS Ltd.
* / Bill / Evridge / X-R-I Testing
Albert / Fletcher / West Penn Testing Group
Ben / Flores / Applied Aerospace Structures Corp.
Sarah / Fuqua / Kearfott Guidance & Navigation Corp.
Steve / Ganske / Precise Machining & Mfg.
Richard / Gasset / Lisi Aerospace
* / Dave / Gray / Mitchell Labs
Stephan / Greimers / ThyssenKrupp VDM
Michael J. / Guthmiller / Applied Aerospace Structures Corp.
Ballard / Hindman / Advanced Coating Technique
Don / Horzewski / Ladish Co, Inc.
Gerard / Hub / G. Cotter Enterprises, Inc.
Tiffani / Ivins / Acuren
Jeff / Jones / Alloy Processing, Inc.
* / Richard / King / New Hampshire Ball Bearings
* / D.E. "Skip" / McDougall / Hitco Carbon Composites
Daniel / McNulty / Haley Industries
Jerome / Mehal / Corpus Christi Army Depot
Mark / Miller / CAD Enterprises
Norm / Miller / Senior Aerospace, Ketema Division
* / Dave / Mitchell / Mitchell NDT Associates, LLC
Manfred / Podlech / IMP
* / Mark / Pompe / West Penn Testing Group
Martin / Reicher / Bohler Forging
Catherine / Renfer / ESCO Turbine Technologies
* / Cindy / Roth / Team Industrial Services
Guy / Saenz / Hi-Tech Metal Finishing
David / Bullard / Hi-Tech Metal Finishing
John / Shue / Modern Drop Forge LLC
* / Ryan / Soule / Alcoa Power and Propulsion Howmet
Kurt / Steinhagen / Metaltek International
Jackie / Sternot / PAKO, Inc.
Dawn / Stokes / PTI Industries Inc.
Mark / Tierney / Laboratory Testing Inc.
Marc / Trepanier / Composites Atlantic Ltd.
Edward / Warter / Carmel Forge Ltd.
* / Gary / White / Orbit Industry
Terrence / White / Special Metals Corp.
Sean / Wood / Triumph Actuation Systems
Brian / Yazumbek / Modern Drop Forge LLC
PRI Staff Present
Mark / AubelePhil / Ford
Mike / Gutridge
1.2 Approval of Previous Meeting Minutes / RAIL Review – OPEN
Motion made by Dave Royce and seconded by Dave Vaughn to approve the June 2010 meeting minutes as written. Motion Passed
The Code of Ethics and the Antitrust policy were reviewed.
The RAIL items were reviewed.
2.0 TASK GROUP REGULAR BUSINESS ITEMS – CLOSED
Auditor Observations – Nine audits were observed since the June 2010 meeting. Comments by the observers were discussed.
The summary of observed Auditors was presented and discussed. Many Auditors have been observed several times recently while others have not been observed in quite some time. This is most likely due to location. Several Subscribers have volunteered to observe these Auditors.
Scope extensions – two audits completed.
Auditor Advisories - none issued.
Extensions - none issued.
Supplier Advisories - discussed.
NIP 7-04 was discussed as it pertains to re-entry audits conducted after a failed audit. The Supplier must wait three months before another audit, which will be considered an initial audit.
Failed audits - Two audits have been failed and neither was overturned.
Lapsed audits - Four audits have lapsed out of 648 conducted in 2010.
Issues with NIP 7-02, NIP 7-03, NOP-002, NTGOP-001, and NTGOP-001 Appendix 1 (NDT) were discussed. Details will be presented during the open meeting.
NDT Sub-Committee and Ad-Hoc team members were reviewed.
Other items discussed were audit review training, audit observations, checklist vision statement, elimination of major / minor ratings, and the number of meetings per year possibly being reduced to two.
3.0 TASK GROUP RESOLUTIONS & CLOSED DISCUSSION POINTS – CLOSED
No resolution items were presented.
Items for the open meeting were discussed.
A Supplier has requested an extension - discussion ensued.
Motion made by Bobby Scott and seconded by Bob Hogan to not grant the requested extension.
Motion Passed
4.0 ETHICS & APPEALS – CLOSED
No items were discussed.
5.0 NEW BUSINESS – CLOSED
A presentation of Level 3 Recertification by a credit system utilizing European National NDTB’s was given by Bobby Scott.
Accepting minor NCR’s on site – should this practice be continued? The Nadcap Management Council (NMC) has determined that each Task Group will decide if this practice will be utilized. NDT will continue to have the option to accept minor NCR’s on site.
Supplier Advisories – There may be changes in the categories of advisories, this is being investigated by the NMC.
There was discussion about whether etch-approved Auditors should receive additional training for etch audits.
An Ad-Hoc Group will be created to explore if additional training maybe needed. Interested parties should contact Scott Sullivan and/or the Chairperson.
ACTION ITEM: Scott Sullivan and Ad-Hoc group to explore additional etch training possibilities. This item is tabled as there were no volunteers for the team. (DUE DATE: N/A)
Mike Shiplett has been approved to review and vote on audits based on the criteria.
The NCR Template Revision Team of Staff Engineers has been reviewing the classification and characterization of NCR’s. The study was presented and discussed. Potential revisions to eAuditNet would include removing some Auditor’s eAuditNet options after documenting a nonconformance and adding others. eAuditNet would then auto-classify the NCR as Minor or Major based on the information entered by the Auditor.
Several Supplier issues were discussed.
6.0 SUPPLEMENTS – CLOSED
The following Supplement revision proposals were reviewed: AC7114S, AC7114/1S, AC7114/2S AC7114/3S, AC7114/4S. Revisions were for U1 and U11.
Motion made by Bob Reynolds and seconded by Pete Torelli to approve the proposed revisions to the supplements. Motion Passed
Supplement revisions for U14 for AC7114/1S and AC7114/4S were presented.
Motion made by Dave Vaughn and seconded by Bob Hogan to approve the proposed revisions to the supplements. Motion Passed
7.0 PRI REPORT / RAIL / NMC METRICS – OPEN
The NDT Staff Report, RAIL, and NMC Metrics were presented – see attached.
Staff delegation for Mark Aubele, Jim Bennett, Phil Ford and Mike Gutridge was presented and reviewed.
8.0 SUPPLIER REPORT & DISCUSSION – OPEN
Gary White presented the Supplier Support Committee (SSC) report – see attached.
9.0 AD-HOC PANEL REPORTS – OPEN
The members of the Ad-Hoc panels were presented and reports given. Phased Array, NAS 410 Rev 3, Filmless Radiography, MRO, and Eddy Current are the current Ad-Hoc panels.
10.0 Nadcap & NDT PROCEDURE REVIEW – OPEN
Procedure Review and Revision report was presented – see attached.
11.0 AQS LIAISON – OPEN
Scott Sullivan presented the AQS Liaison report – see attached.
12.0 TECHNICAL ISSUES AND OPEN DISCUSSION ITEMS – OPEN
Key discussion points:
· It was proposed that Phil Keown of GE Aviation continue to serve as Chairperson for a three-year term.
Motion made by Pete Torelli and seconded by Dave Vaughn to re-affirm Phil Keown as the NDT Task Group Chairperson for a three year term. Motion Passed
· LED lights: At this time no Subscriber prohibits their use, or states they are allowed.
· The tumbling “E” eye exam: Procedure must state the method of eye exam the Supplier is using. The British NDT board will be mandating this method for the eye exam.
· Specific exam questions: The specific exam must contain non-look up type questions.
· What is the definition of monthly for the monthly checks? Checks will be performed at least once a month.
· Refractometer check new material - Is an initial refractometer check required when emulsifier is mixed and then discarded after use or within one week? The answer is yes.
· Calibration of oven controller must be done while the oven is on.
· TAM panel crack growth: If a panel’s indications change over time can the panel be “re-baselined”? If it is determined that the growth was due to a change in the panel and not the system, then yes. Several other TAM panel items were discussed.
· Inspection trainees and direct observation: Is the wording of direct supervision vs. direct observation (as stated in NAS 410) acceptable? If the definition of direct supervision as defined in the supplier’s Written Practice is consistent with the NAS 410 definition of direct observation it is acceptable.
· Examinations: If a new exam is required as a result of a corrective action during an audit, how is it to be handled? New questions or a new test to be administered depending on the extent of the finding. The Auditor needs to be clear on the discrepancy and the Supplier needs to give clear corrective action on their investigation. This will tell the Task Group and Staff Engineers the course of action. Additional questions are not to be given at the next certification; this must be corrected as part of the corrective action for the NCR.
· Technique Signatures: Supplier Level 3 signature on technique means it is acceptable unless customer approval is required. Putting N/A or NR or leaving Customer approval block blank is okay if the part does not require customer approval. There is no AS9100 requirement to have all blocks filled in. The Auditor must investigate to determine if Customer approval is required.
· The work instruction for Auditor Advisories and Supplier Alerts was discussed. An attempt will be made to include distribution of Auditor Advisories to the Suppliers.
· Known defect samples: Can the same pieces be utilized for each certification cycle?
ACTION ITEM: PRI Staff to query the NAS 410 group – Are the test specimens utilized for practical exams required to be different for each certification cycle. Can the same pieces be used for the recertification exams that were used for previous exam? (DUE DATE: 15-Feb-11)
ACTION ITEM: PRI Staff to issue an Auditor Advisory/Supplier Alert in regards to signature blocks on techniques not being required to be completed if customer signature is not required. (DUE DATE: 15-Nov-10)
ACTION ITEM: PRI Staff to issue an Auditor Advisory/Supplier Alert in regards to specific exams and the recent clarifications received from the AIA. (DUE DATE: 15-Nov-10)
ACTION ITEM: PRI Staff to issue an Auditor Advisory/Supplier Alert defining that if the definition of direct supervision as defined in the supplier’s Written Practice is consistent with the NAS 410 definition of direct observation it is acceptable. (DUE DATE: 15-Nov-10)
13.0 NEW BUSINESS – OPEN
A presentation of Level 3 Recertification by a credit system utilizing a European National NDT Board’s was given by Bobby Scott.
What is the expectation of certification reports of FPI materials to the test reports? Does the cert need to reference the batch number? This question will be investigated by the Sub-Committee Chair.