CITY OF NOWTHEN
PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION MEETING
TUESDAY, January 22, 2013 @ 7:00 P.M.
(Minutes are being taped for transcribing purposes only)
Present: Jeff Pilon Harold Jorgensen Dale Ames
Mary Rainville Jim Scheffler Robert Mahutga
Absent: Barry Wagner
Others: Elizabeth Stockman,
The Planning Company LLC
Chairman Ames called the meeting to order at 7:00 PM
· Pledge of Allegiance
· Approve/Amend tonight’s meeting agenda – January 22, 2013
Pilon made motion to approve tonight’s meeting agenda of January 22, 2013. Jorgensen seconded the motion, all in favor; motion carried.
· Approve/Amend the November 27, 2012 Planning & Zoning Meeting Minutes - Ames made motion to approve November 27, 2012 Planning & Zoning Meeting Minutes. Pilon seconded the motion all in favor; motion carried.
1. PUBLIC HEARING – A request by Robert & Jeanne Schiller for property owned at 21269 Jarvis Street NW, for an Interim Use Permit. An Interim Use Permit is required to allow a home extended business in the RRA, Rural Residential Agriculture District to operate a metal recycling business within the two existing pole buildings, measuring 80 X 100 and 80 X 160. PIN #15-33-25-41-0009.
Robert Schiller said he would like an IUP for this business. He said he wanted to clarify that it’s not like a normal metal recycling business where people are coming in and out; it is very limited as far as traffic goes. There is no stuff stored outside, everything is inside. He is asking for this business (IUP) be allowed to operate for a limited time – say for 5 years and then see if there are any complaints or issues to be addressed afterwards.
Ames said that this issue has been before the P & Z before. It was decided that in order to do this there would have to be an ordinance change in order to allow this recycling business.
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Planning & Zoning Mtg. Jan. 22, 2013 Page 2
Elk River resident bordering Nowthen Jan Hislop at 9164 213th Ave said she lives kitty-corner across from this business. She said she has lived in the Nowthen Agricultural District for 25 years. She does not want to be in a commercial district. She does not want to see another Alters (Recycling Business) like the one that is in Anoka here in Nowthen in her front yard.
She said she knew from the meetings before the owner of this business was told in December to cease and move to a commercial district. She also stated that this recycling business is not allowed in a residential district. (since it is not listed as an Interim Use under the RRA).
She said when Robert Schiller and his wife purchased this property in December that they knew that this business had been turned down also.
Ms. Hislop said this request is for an IUP for a home extended home occupation for a metal recycling business and the City of Nowthen does not allow this type of business as a permitted use. If the City is willing to allow this recycling business at this location (RRA) then you are saying another could be located at any place in Nowthen. If you start one, more will follow.
It was told that the cleaners are water soluble, but how do we know it is not contaminating the ground water?
Ms. Hislop said her office looks over to this residence and she sees full size semi’s, flat beds, white trucks coming and going all the time and she brought along pictures of these vehicles with her tonight if the commission would like to see them from the period of the last couple of weeks.
She said she is okay with all the items of Ag such as horses, cows, or farm trucks & tractors.
Another thing she says with all the vehicles going in that there must be 5 to 10 employees that work there and for an extended home occupation there should be only 1 and 2 part time employees allowed.
They also put an American Flag out at the end of the driveway to catch attention of the truck drivers.
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Planning & Zoning Mtg. Jan. 22, 2013 Page 3
She is also wondering if this business would be approved, which God Forbid she hopes it will not be, how will it be taxed properly as a commercial business?
Again she said she has pictures to leave if the commission would like to have them for this Public Hearing. These pictures were left to have for reviewing.
Again Ms. Hislop said she wanted to repeat that this area is rural residential agricultural and not a commercial district.
Elk River resident bordering Nowthen - Lori Rudell at 9685 213th Ave said that her main concern is if this business is complying with the EPA regulations and that if this is affecting ground water it affects a lot of residents. She says this is a big concern if this business is not complying with the zoning laws what other laws are they not complying with then?
Elk River resident bordering Nowthen – Dennis Booth at 9993 213th Ave said please do not allow this business to stay here. He is very worried that they are not handling run off of their recycling operations properly.
Elk River resident bordering Nowthen – Dennis Drews at 21200 Jarvis St. (just south of this entrance) said it is hard to tell with new owners and he is around the property, since he is semi-retired, to see that there is extended traffic coming and going – anytime of the day there is traffic. It can be mid-day, afternoon, late evening - anytime day or night there is traffic coming and going. He said he feels this business itself is not compatible with the residential agricultural area. Mr. Drews said he respectfully requests that this not be approved.
Elk River resident bordering Nowthen – Dirk Hetland at 21615 Edison Circle said he lives on 21 acres and moved in sometime back and he knows that this business was operating undercover and was operating without proper permits. He says it makes him suspicious when someone is operating without the proper permits. He said when he had his own business; he applied for the proper permits. He questions if the EPA knew about this business and if so that they are complying with their regulations.
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Planning & Zoning Mtg. Jan. 22, 2013 Page 4
Mr. Hetland said the last time he was here for the last owner’s Public Hearing there was going to be a set of conditions required but it is suspicious when this business moves into a residentially zoned area and starts up – and the neighbors don’t know what is going on.
Mr. Hetland said he also had a couple of neighbors who asked to speak for them because they could not be at this meeting and relay to the commission that they are not in favor of this recycling business to operate at this address. So Mr. Hetland said they are all opposed to this business continuing in their neighborhood.
Elk River resident bordering Nowthen – Dave Miller at 10011 215th Ave said he is mainly concerned if running illegally and if the EPA, Fire Dept. and OSHA have been contacted and if things are being operated correctly. He said because if they haven’t been, the employees there could have been affected by this too.
Mr. Schiller asked if he could address a couple of these concerns. He said that yes on July 20th the Fire Marshall had come in to check the business out. He said as far as a lot of traffic goes – he doesn’t know who that would be but there are no flat beds. Last summer there was repossessing going on (regarding previous owner Hardle and the previous occupant of the home, Soltvedt) and so there were vehicles coming and going at that time. But he said that won’t be happening anymore. He said he will keep everything inside. He said there is nothing going into the septic system and that there is a sand separator and if anyone wants to come over and inspect they are welcome to do so. He said there are no outside employees only 2 guys running the business besides him owning this property. He said there are guys going across the fields behind his property and drive through to get to them. So if that is where the traffic is coming from he doesn’t know.
Mr. Schiller said this is not a 5 acre lot this is 27 acres and if the City wanted to be some stipulations on it, he is fine with that.
Mahutga asked Mr. Schiller if this is the same recycling business that has been running there before he bought the property. Mr. Schiller said yes it is the same business and when he bought the property, they were looking for a place for their business. And he moved from the city that was anti-business all the way around and he commented that he hoped Nowthen would not be anti-business.
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He feels that this recycling business is in their incubation stage and just getting started as far as employees and a tax base goes. Why shouldn’t Nowthen be their home instead of another surrounding city other than City of Ramsey?
Mahutga asked if he owned this business? Mr. Schiller said no, but if he needed to and if they needed investments he would have no problem doing that also.
Mr. Schiller asked if there were any other questions, he’d be glad to answer and if anyone wants to come and check this business out further, they are welcome to do so, just give him a call.
Mahutga questioned Mr. Schiller how is this business going to change
from the previous requested IUP for the recycling business and all of the truck traffic that was reported at that time?
Mr. Schiller said the business before had a couple of other businesses running besides the recycling which were boiling company and a directional boring company and that is where the trucks were coming from. There won’t be any more of that now.
Mahutga asked what the exact nature of this recycle business is?
Mr. Schiller said it is shavings from machine shops being cleaned and recycled. These are stored on 4 X 4 containers and only 2 people work with these.
Mr. Schiller said he also has a business that is Ready Watt Electric.
Pilon questioned Mr. Schiller if he will be running his own business out of his residence also? Mr. Schiller said yes – but mainly out of his office out of his home. The rest of his business is run out of the cities and all over the state. Pilon questioned if he won’t have any additional business or additional traffic at his residence? No, he said the most traffic would be his wife running his kids back and forth to school.
Rainville said she wanted to ask Mr. Schiller to clarify that a resident of Nowthen has to own the business in order to be approved for an IUP.
Mr. Schiller said he would ask that the ordinance be amended to allow recycle center as a permitted use that could be done by the city.
Rainville said on the Public Hearing notice she did not see anything saying to request for an amendment change to our ordinances.
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Rainville said she didn’t feel there was any need to look further because Mr. Schiller is not the owner of the business in the first place and the actual application was for an IUP not an amendment to our ordinance.
Pilon asked if property was combined now – the 7 and 20 acres? Answer was yes it had been combined as one 27 acre piece.
Ames questioned Ms. Stockman, our Planner. if this were allowed by an amendment change wouldn’t this be setting a precedence? Ms. Stockman said that the ordinance could be amended to allow recycling as an Interim Use with a set of conditions but it would be impossible to address every nuisance or possibility and keep any certain types of recycling from coming in. The City could not discriminate against any other kinds of recyclables then.
Mahutga said he would like to see a business, such as this recycling in the commercial district.
Rainville again said the business owner must own and live at the
residence where the business is located. When this is presented last time it was the consensus to have recycling only in a commercial area whether he owned the business or not.
PUBLIC HEARING CLOSED – RECOMMENDATIONS FROM P & Z.
Rainville stated this is an extended home occupation and it doesn’t fit in
with the community, so it can’t go any further than that.
Ames stated he was skeptical when calling a business recycling
because it is opening up a big can of worms.
Mahutga said it’s not an ideal place for this business and, as heard
Tonight, not a lot of blending in by the residents who spoke out tonight
Either. Also the biggest issue is Mr. Schiller does not own the business
and everyone else who has applied for an IUP in the City previously has
owned their business.
Scheffler said he feels there is a discrepancy also with the amount of
traffic from what Mr. Schiller has stated and what neighbors have stated
here tonight.
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Comment was made that it was thought that the previous owner asked
for an extension to find another location to move the recycling center to
and never pursued it and it was thought they were working with owners
to purchase – but obviously this didn’t happen either, because now we
don’t see any difference from the last request to this one.
Jorgensen said both IUP’s & CUP’s would be affected if we were to
allow or amend the ordinance to include this as a permitted use for
IUP’s.
Residents have to meet requirements of our Ordinances by owning their business and living at that property. If allowing amendment changes like this it would be for a resident’s special interest. Those are nice buildings, but the buildings do not fit after the owner is now gone. Probably the best fit or use of these large buildings would be for storage of motor homes or other storage and can come within the ordinance requirements.