ERMTGSRR(17)029019r1
Title*: / TGSRR#29_chairman_meeting_notesfrom Source*: / WG/TG Chairman
Contact: / Michael Mahler
input for Committee*: / ERM TGSRR
Contribution For*: / Decision / X
Discussion
Information
Submission date*: / 2017-10-26
Meeting & Allocation: / ERMTGSRR#29 -
Relevant WI(s), or deliverable(s):
Decision/action requested: Please approve
ABSTRACT:
1. Approval Agenda
è Agenda was approved as in r5
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029003r5_Agenda_TG_SRR_29.docx
2. Participants
Name / Organization / Presence / ShortcutErnst, Frank / ROBERT BOSCH GmbH / yes / F.E.
Germaine, Sylvain / AUTOCRUISE S.A.S. a ZF TRW company / Yes, until 25th 14:00 / S.G.
John, Andreas / Hella KGaA Hueck & Co. / yes / J.A.
Kallenborn, Ralf / Federal Ministry of Economic Affairs and Energy / yes / R.K
Long, Nicholas / Great Circle Design / yes / N.L
Mahler, Michael / ROBERT BOSCH GmbH / yes / M.M
Minaev, Igor / European Telecommunications Standards Institute / yes / I.M
Reitmayer, Thomas / Continental Automotive GmbH / yes / Th.R
Sturm, Christian / Valeo Radar Systems Inc. (VRS) / yes / Ch.S
Woodington, Walter Gordon / Magna Electronics Europe GmbH / yes / W.W.
Meeting ended: 26th of October @ 12:40
3. IPR
Text for the formal call for IPR disclosures to be made at the beginning of each meeting
"The attention of the members of this Technical Body is drawn to the fact that ETSI Members shall use reasonable endeavours under clause 4.1 of the ETSI IPR Policy, Annex 6 of the Rules of Procedure, to inform ETSI of Essential IPRs in a timely fashion. This section covers the obligation to notify its own IPRs but also other companies’ IPRs.
The members take note that they are hereby invited:
· to investigate in their company whether their company does own IPRs which are, or are likely to become Essential in respect of the work of the Technical Body,
· to notify to the Chairman or to the ETSI Director-General all potential IPRs that their company may own, by means of the IPR Information Statement and the Licensing Declaration forms that they can obtain from the ETSI Technical Officer or http://www.etsi.org/legal/IPR-Forms.
Members are encouraged to make general IPR undertakings/declarations that they will make licenses available for all their IPRs under FRAND terms and conditions related to a specific standardization area and then, as soon as feasible, provide (or refine) detailed disclosures."
Reminder of applicable antitrust and competition laws
The attention of the members of this group is drawn to the fact that ETSI activities are subject to all applicable antitrust and competition laws and that compliance with said laws is therefore required of any participant of this meeting including the Chairman and Vice Chairmen. The leadership shall conduct the present meeting with impartiality. In case of question it is recommended that you contact your legal counsel.
This reminder shall be reflected in the meeting minutes as follows:
Reminder of applicable antitrust and competition laws
The attention of all participants to the meeting was drawn to the fact that ETSI activities are subject to all applicable antitrust and competition laws and that compliance with said laws is therefore required by any participant of the meeting, including the Chairman and Vice-Chairmen.
è No IPR
Topics/Status/Points which shall be taken into account
Status ERC REC 70-03, EC DEC(s)
- new Annex 5 of ERC REC 70-03
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017/ERMTGSRR(17)029004_new_Annex_5_ERCREC_70-03.docx
Contribution GCD (N.L.) (excerpt SRD-MG minutes)
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029013_Extract_from_SRDMG_minutes.docx
Discussion
- this point shall be taken into account during a possible revision of the HEN
- M.M explained what could happen if we take it, take it without limits, …. Into account
o EC desk officer requested values/limits for all requirements
o Or NSO could vote negative / inputs during ENAP if we have no limits,…
- It was mentioned that this is a REC à not clear in which way implemented in the national rule à not clear what will happen during 7th EC-SRD update
- It was proposed to put this only into the scope or EN 301 091-2 (no limits)
- It was noted that ECC the report 262 is not clear à limits / requirements are not clear given
- It was noted that the report 262 is not complete
è Two ways/possibilities/questions à future discussion
· Is it possible to specify a set of generic parameter?
· Or only within the scope of EN?
è It was noted that currently the new “Note” is not an harmonized issue à could be in future
(7th update of EC SRD decision)
Decision TG SRR#29: TG SRR will not create a WI at that time for revising EN 301 091-2. This point will be taken into account during a future revision of EN 301 091-2.
Revision will be started after clarification of RX-requirement issue is solved.
Status blocked EN
- Review last meeting notes / EC desk officer comments (https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029001_Collection_comments_EU_on_ENs.docx)
EC desk officer answer @ 17th Oct. on our assessment on EN 302 264 & EN 302 288
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017/ERMTGSRR(17)029006_EC_answer_to_TG_SRR_assessment_EN_302_264_and_302_288.docx
Contribution BMWi of the received comments from EC on EN 302 288
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029008_Comments_to_document_ERMTGSRR_17_029006_BMWI.zip
Action for M.M.: distribute doc of Michael Sharp on the differences in EN (harmonized and presumption of conformity (OJEU listed)
Contribution GCD (N.L.) at second day (25th October) on RX Noise test
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029015_Noise_Figure_approach_to_Rx_specifications.docx
Provided revision by N.L. of 029015r1 à included within ERMTGSRR(17)029016
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029015r1_Noise_Figure_approach_to_Rx_specifications.docx
- Status ETSI STF BN
Verbal report from M.M. and I.M. about possible start (plan November), number of experts (status 6) and focus/topics/actions à (see T.o.R)
- Discussion on
o Measurement uncertainty, what is reachable?
Note: general ERM discussion (leaded by RM) to provide a document to EC and ADCO.
For information: TG UWB assessment:
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGUWB/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGUWB(17)041002_Assessment_on_MU_for_UWB.docx
Shopping list was updated, see: ERMTGSRR(16)000015r2
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017/ERMTGSRR(16)000015r2_Shopping-List_actions_points_for_future_revsions.docx
Can TG SRR a short summary for the ERM discussion?
o For Wanted performance requirements, what are the use-cases?
è under each EN?
è What are the related requirements? à e.g. on blocking/sensitivity/Noise?
è Possible tests for Blocking/Sensitivity (direct or indirect?) and related influences to use-cases?
è Contribution to STF BN?
è Possible Interference signals?
è Influence from IMT2020 discussion? à see Agenda point ITU-R studies
o Next steps, NWI`s update or restructure of ENs?
Decision: TG SRR#29 decided not create NWIs for updating the HS now. First the RX-requirement issue need to be solved.
Note: we shall only prepare NWI`s if we really can finalize in a given time?
Note: from and for shopping list:
è At the OOB/in-band point and 0dBm/MHz à problem e.g. for FMCW à included in ERMTGSRR(16)000015r2
è Definition of the interference signal (from the former resolution meetings) for the current wanted performance criteria tests (is in ERMTGSRR(16)000015r2)
Result: Summary of the discussion on RX-requirements:
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017/ERMTGSRR(17)029016r1_Summary_RX-Requirement_discussion.docx
- TG UWB: UWB>120GHz
http://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERM/70-DRAFTS/00564/ERM-564v111_003.docx
Document shall be finalized during TG UWB November 2017
TG SRR was informed about the status and the time schedule
Next TG UWB meeting: 28 to 30.11 @ ETSI HQ
- Report from outside ECC/EC
o USA
Status FCC Part 95 à currently only report and order
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017/ERMTGSRR(17)029005_FCC_Permitting_Radar_Services_in_the_76_81_GHz_Band.pdf
TG SRR was informed about the status (publication FCC part 95 – H and KDB request on vehicle definition) and the time schedule
o ITU-R studies (adjacent range/OOB, spurious below 76 and above 81GHz) à important for RX-requirements, considerations on the impact of IMT2020 systems into automotive radars with regards to the following 2 ongoing activities:
· WRC 2019 AI 1.13 (res 238) bands identified for IMT2020
o 24.25-27.5GHz
o 66-76GHz
o 81-86GHz
· ECC 5G Mandate: ECC(17)016
o Under the mandate, the Band 24.25 – 27.5GHz was identified as a pioneer band for 5G in Europe and to be harmonized before 2020.
o mandate:
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017/ERMTGSRR(17)029009_EU_5G_Mandate_.pdf
è 26GHz studies are in PT1 à core band shall be fixed until 2020
è For 76GHz à currently no studies on ECC studies. à meeting doc. 10
è Bosch, Conti & VW planning to prepare a contribution for AK1 on 76GHz issue à will be a input for PT1
Two questions:
è Protection requirements for future ITU documents
è What level of spurious are acceptable? à wanted performance criteria, RX-requirement
For discussion: contribution Robert Bosch GmbH
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017/ERMTGSRR(17)029010_Considerations_on_the_impact_of_IMT2020_into_automotive_rada.DOCX
Continental contribution
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029011_Continental_Input_to_Sharing_Studies_between_automotive_rada.docx
è Also related to LSin ??
LSin from ITU-R WP5A on the revision of recommendation ITU-R M.2084-0
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERM/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERM(17)062060_LSin_from_ITU-R_WP5A_on_the_revision_of_recommendation_ITU-R.docx
ITU-R M.2084-0
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017/ERMTGSRR(17)029007_ITU-R_M_2084-0.docx
è After review no action for TG SRR, M.M. will inform ERM Chair (done during TG SRR#29)
New Thai regulation
Contribution GCD:
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029012_Translation_of_Thai_regulation.docx
è It was discussed but ETSI is not really able to help.
à topic for e.g. ACEA/CLEPA: S.G. will take as an action for next ACEA/CLEPA meeting
- Next meetings
TG SRR#30: 4th of December 14:00 – 16:00 CET, G2M
http://portal.etsi.org/webapp/MeetingCalendar/MeetingDetails.asp?m_id=33611
Possible next meeting will be fixed in December @ TG SRR#30
- TG SRR officials
o Chairman: term of Michael Mahler will end December 2017,
next appointment @ ERM#64
o Vice-Chair: new appointment @ next TG SRR regular meeting
o Secretary position: vacant
M.M explained situation, the discussion/appointments are an issue for TG SRR#30. M.M. will prepare an call for experts (vice-chair and secretary), Chairman will be appointed by ERM (Feb 2018) but TG SRR could propose/support an Chairman.
M.M. stated that he will be available for an additional term
- A.o.B
o Field tests
Contribution Continental
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029014_Field_Operation_testing_Licences_on_EU_CEPT_level.docx
Action M.M. will ask Michael Sharp / Holger Butscheidt (Chairman TC ERM) if
è the test license procedure could be harmonized
è and for which devices (new development under existing regulation, revision of a current certified device/permissive change, device under “new” range -_> regulatory discussion/ECC studies ongoing) a test license is necessary
è Topic for ECC or ADCO?
o Update ETSI EMC-EN
- Next meeting ETSI/EC @ 8th of January 2018
- We have to wait if this would lead to any actions on 489-51
· Intra-sharing/channelization/frequency access within EN (during upcoming revision)
M.M warned the group. Before implementing such “requirements” intoa EN à a detailed evaluation is necessary (discussion on EN 300 328 was given as an example).
Therefore, M.M proposed to work/discuss this issue during the preparation of the new SRdoc WI (77-81GHz).
Possible solutions could be
Option 1:
- direct implementation into this new SRdoc
Note M.M: if in the SRdoc it could become part of the regulation
Option 2:
- preparation of specific documents (TR or TS)
Note M.M: this solution is more an “sharing agreement between the stakeholders, not part of the regulation
- and after clarification/evaluation: Implementation into the related ENs
TG SRR#29 agreed on this way forward à discussion for next meetings
· M.M informed TG SRR members about a possible new SRdoc WI within TG UWB that to request for a more generic regulation of UWB LPR equipment.
Details currently not known
Next TG UWB meeting: 28 to 30.11 @ ETSI HQ
Notes first day (24th of October)
IMT 2020 issue
Action: F.E. will distribute draft to TG SRR reflector (until 27th October)
(also planned as RB/VW/Conti to AK1 (Germany) à PT1)
Note: A.J. (Hella) will check 24GHz NB, Conti for 24 GHz UWB
Action: feedback to F.E: until 3rd of November
After finalization
S.G. and Ch.S. à final to get support in France
N.L. à final to get support in UK
G.W. à final to get support in Austria
SE21_LSout
Text was prepared by R.K., see
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029017_draft_LS_to_SE21_on_spurious_emissions.docx
Result/Final and approved:
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029018_TG_SRR_Questions_on_spurious_emissions_limits.docx
New WI for 77 to 81GHz
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERM/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017/ERM(17)63b004_Revision_Regulation_for_77-81GHz_for_vehicles.zip
NWI was discussed and proposal as in ERM(17)63b004 was approved by TG SRR#29
Notes second day (25th of October)
Points of the discussion were summarized within:
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017//ERMTGSRR(17)029016_Summary_RX-Requirement_discussion.docx
https://docbox.etsi.org/ERM/ERMTGSRR/05-CONTRIBUTIONS/2017/ERMTGSRR(17)029016r1_Summary_RX-Requirement_discussion.docx
1/10